# Copycat suicide



## David Baxter PhD (Mar 28, 2009)

Copyshop suicide
by Vaughan, _MindHacks Blog_
March 28, 2009

_Bad Science_ has a great article on the 'copycat suicide' effect, where media reporting of suicide can increase the chances of suicide in other people.

Copycat suicide is sometimes called the 'Werther Effect', after Goethe published his 1774 novel, _The Sorrows of Young Werther_, which depicted Werther's suicide and was reportedly followed by people imitating the same method to end their lives.

It's an interesting effect because it shows the influence on the media on what people usually think of the most extreme of decisions.

An excellent 2003 review article on the subject found that the effect holds for all media reports of suicides (including fictional ones) but celebrity suicide is most associated with subsequent deaths. Interestingly, it notes that the largest known increase followed the death of Marilyn Monroe.

The review also found found that the greater the coverage of the suicide, and the more details in the reporting, the larger the increase in subsequent deaths.

Because of this, there are now media guidelines for reporting suicide, and the Bad Science article reports on a particularly bad example where the journalist reported exactly the sort of thing most associated with increased risk in a single story - virtually nothing except details of the suicide method.

One of the most interesting bits of the _Bad Science_ piece doesn't appear in the print version. However, it discusses research that found the majority of people who attempt suicide and survive are pleased they did some years later:

_There is a literature which I think is extremely powerful, and yet unanimously ignored by mainstream media, and that is the follow-up data on what happens later in life to people who have felt so suicidal that they have made serious attempts on their own lives.

In extremis Pajonk et al followed up a large number of people who they picked up in intensive care after very serious suicide attempts. Amongst those who survived, and did not have serious psychotic illnesses, six years later, the majority were happy and well, living productive family lives, and were ? we might reasonably interpolate - glad to be alive._​

_Bad Science_ article on media reporting of suicide.
Review article on media and suicide (with open-access link).


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## Atlantean (Mar 28, 2009)

When I was really struggling I made several very serious suicide attempts, and Im glad now that I am here. I had a dear friend who I would talk to who was involved in my life at the time these were going on, and she made a very good point:

"Suicide is a permanent solution, to short-term problems".

Now, Some problems arent short-term, but I think its a good thing to consider when you are in the depths and throes of despair and considering suicide as an alternative.


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## NicNak (Mar 28, 2009)

Correct me if I am wrong, but I believe in Ontario the media does not report on the suicides that happen.

Although they did report Kirt Cobain's.  But the local folk are not reported in the media to help prevent the Copycat effect.

Is this uncommon?  are most others reported in other places?


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## Atlantean (Mar 28, 2009)

I find it fascinating that just because someone else kills themselves, people find it easier to take their own lives.

I am particularly intrigued because my husbands father committed suicide, and I know that there are times I have worried about my husband (especially during our separation which will end next week-yay!), who has remarked about it rather causally at times, when hes under extremely stressful and depressing situations.

Dr. Baxter, why is it that if a family member or someone you know has committed suicide that you are more prone to commit the act, yourself?  I knew a fellow who committed suicide, but I dont feel it had any impact on my likelihood or lack thereof to do so. I mean, I had tried before and since, but he had nothing to do with it.

Are people really just that weak that they are that easily influenced?


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## NicNak (Mar 28, 2009)

I am curious to that answer too Atlantean.  I recall too with Kirt Cobain's suicide, there were many copy cat's too.  

Thanks for posting that question.  I am curious to know the reasoning too.


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## Atlantean (Mar 28, 2009)

I think with celebrity suicides its a little bit of a different dynamic..you know, especially if the celeb was known (and idolized) for his angst and pain and glorified drug addiction. I mean I can see how those kids end up doing it, but not random strangers having the same effect.


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## NicNak (Mar 28, 2009)

That's true Atlantean, I didn't look at it in that perspective, but it makes perfect sense what you said.

When I have had suicidal thoughts it was never amplified by others either.  I remember my sister-in-laws friend attempted suicide, while I was in a bad way too.   I personally don't think it swayed me either way.

It is possable that it could be a trigger, such as how we all have different triggers that can influence how we feel.  

I wonder if there is an  suceptibility for the influence as well, like possably folks who have not recieved treatment, or have not formed the coping skills, or have had therapy to trust that there are other options.   

Many people may live, hiding their mental illness feeling there is no one who understands and have no one to talk to.


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## Atlantean (Mar 28, 2009)

NicNak said:


> <snip>
> 
> Many people may live, hiding their mental illness feeling there is no one who understands and have no one to talk to.



I agree with that sad but all too true statement. My husband has battled severe depression all his life though he has really concealed it well by suppression and internalization, but he has agreed to start counseling once he gets back home, which I think will be very good for him.

I think the only thing worse than the people who have no one to understand or talk to, are the ones who desperately need and want help, but cant find the adequate resources within their community to receive it.


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## NicNak (Mar 28, 2009)

Atlantean said:


> I agree with that sad but all too true statement. My husband has battled severe depression all his life though he has really concealed it well by suppression and internalization, but he has agreed to start counseling once he gets back home, which I think will be very good for him.



That is great Atlantean.  It is also great that you will both be able to relate to one another too.   I am glad he is going to start counceling and agreed to it.  That is a huge step for him.  I am so happy for you both. 



> I think the only thing worse than the people who have no one to understand or talk to, are the ones who desperately need and want help, but cant find the adequate resources within their community to receive it.



Yes! Those situations are very sad to see too.

 I am thankful every day that I recieve the care I do.  

I always seem to research "but what if" resouces and write down numbers and such, when I am in a "good" way.  So for the times when I might need them, I just have to look them up.

I know when I am in a panic mode or having an "episode" I am in no position to be trying to locate phone numbers I might need.

That might be a useful tip actually.  To have ones "ducks lined up" just incase, then it doesn't add more to an already stressful situation.


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## Atlantean (Mar 28, 2009)

NicNak said:


> That is great Atlantean.  It is also great that you will both be able to relate to one another too.   I am glad he is going to start counceling and agreed to it.  That is a huge step for him.  I am so happy for you both.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Very good suggestion. LOL, I have my therapists cell phone number in my cell phone. and I still remember my old teams numbers my heart.  '-)


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## Yuray (Mar 28, 2009)

I knew a man once. He said to me, without a trace of emotion, and in a venue that was joyous. “ suicide is not about a desire for death, it is about a desire to be free from pain”. He said this while holding a drink in his hand, making no eye contact, and it was addressed to whatever emptiness his eyes were focused on. “Take away the pain, and you remove the need for death". Suicide is simply pain relief.

 "The cause of the pain becomes irrelevant. The diminishment of the pain is imperative“. He spoke with quiet authority, as one does when they know the outcome of a situation, long before others are aware of it. He put down his half empty drink, excused himself, then left.


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## Jazzey (Mar 28, 2009)

:agree:  The only time I've ever trully considered suicide was when the pain was so great that I couldn't see any other way out, when I was so lost in the pain that no other solution existed...Thankfully, and for whatever reason, if you can just hang on to one more day, the tunnel widens a little and you just start hanging on for one more day, and yet another, and yet another....


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## forgetmenot (Mar 29, 2009)

I believe that suicidal behavior is inherited just as with other mental illnesses. I don't know if this is proven or not but it seems to make sense.


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## Jazzey (Mar 29, 2009)

I think that this is part of the equation Mary.  But I don't think it's the whole picture.  I think that some people may indeed inherit depression, or the propensity for it. And unfortunately, when we've been exposed to suicide in our lives, this too can really affect our view of it.  People who have known suicide in their direct lives are more vulnerable to thinking about suicide or considering suicide as an option.

So as long as we're educated about these things, we now have the tools to protect ourselves.  To take care of our mental and physical health - much like you're doing with your psychologist right now Mary.  But it is important to tell him about any suicidal thoughts that you may be having.


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## Atlantean (Mar 29, 2009)

Atlantean said:


> I find it fascinating that just because someone else kills themselves, people find it easier to take their own lives.
> 
> I am particularly intrigued because my husbands father committed suicide, and I know that there are times I have worried about my husband (especially during our separation which will end next week-yay!), who has remarked about it rather causally at times, when hes under extremely stressful and depressing situations.
> 
> ...



Still waiting for Dr. Baxters response to this post. I believe NicNack was, too.  '-)


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## Retired (Mar 29, 2009)

> just because someone else kills themselves, people find it easier to take their own lives



David may elaborate on the dynamics of this phenomenon, but I believe there is literature to support the increased risk of suicide among people who came in contact, within the last several months, with a person who completed a suicide.

Research shows that risk factors for suicide include:


depression and other mental disorders, or a substance-abuse disorder (often in combination with other mental disorders). More than 90 percent of people who die by suicide have these risk factors.2 
stressful life events, in combination with other risk factors, such as depression. However, suicide and suicidal behavior are not normal responses to stress; many people have these risk factors, but are not suicidal. 
prior suicide attempt 
family history of mental disorder or substance abuse 
family history of suicide 
family violence, including physical or sexual abuse 
firearms in the home, the method used in more than half of suicides 
incarceration 
exposure to the suicidal behavior of others, such as family members, peers, or media figures.
Research also shows that the risk for suicide is associated with changes in brain chemicals called neurotransmitters, including serotonin. Decreased levels of serotonin have been found in people with depression, impulsive disorders, and a history of suicide attempts, and in the brains of suicide victims. 

Source for Risk Factors: NIMH


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## Daniel (Mar 29, 2009)

Regarding greater susceptibility to suicide after media reporting, one explanation:



> Explanations of the media impact on suicide have centred on social learning theory or modelling. This theory states that if one learns that there are troubled people who solve life’s problems through suicide, others who identify with them may copy the behaviour. In addition, there is the concept of differrential identification that refines this concept by postulating that the impact a story has is directly related to the degree of identification they have with the type of story (e.g. of celebrities), perhaps accounting for the greater impact of celebrity suicide reporting. The last explanation describes how the audience mood (i.e. suicidogenic conditions such as high unemployment and divorce rates) increases the copycat effect of suicide reports.
> 
> http://www.annals.edu.sg/pdf/37VolNo9Sep2008/V37N9p797.pdf


Of course, for some depressed people, such media reporting could, if anything, actually lower their risk, such as by making their depression seem less painfully unique and encouraging them to seek professional help.



			
				NicNak said:
			
		

> But the local folk are not reported in the media to help prevent the Copycat effect.



Same in the United States.


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## David Baxter PhD (Mar 29, 2009)

Atlantean said:


> Dr. Baxter, why is it that if a family member or someone you know has committed suicide that you are more prone to commit the act, yourself?





NicNak said:


> Thanks for posting that question.  I am curious to know the reasoning too.





Atlantean said:


> Still waiting for Dr. Baxters response to this post. I believe NicNack was, too.



I'm under the weather again today (a resurgence of that cold or flu thing that hit me last week) but I believe Steve and Daniel and others have outlined some of the reasons above.


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## NicNak (Mar 29, 2009)

Yes, Jazzey, Steve and Daniel explained it very well.  Thank you.

Hope you feel better soon Dr Baxter.


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## ladylore (Mar 29, 2009)

> I'm under the weather again today (a resurgence of that cold or flu thing that hit me last week)



Have you seen your doctor yet David? Make sure everything is a ok.


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## David Baxter PhD (Mar 29, 2009)

No, it's just a virus. A lot of my clients plus two of my sons have had it.


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