# Forgiveness: How to let go of grudges and bitterness



## David Baxter PhD

Forgiveness: How to let go of grudges and bitterness
By Katherine M. Piderman, Mayo Clinic
Nov 21, 2007

_When someone you care about hurts you, you can hold on to anger, resentment and thoughts of revenge or embrace forgiveness and move forward._

Nearly everyone has been hurt by the actions or words of another. Your mother criticized your parenting skills. Your friend gossiped about you. Your partner had an affair. These wounds can leave you with lasting feelings of anger, bitterness and even vengeance. But when you don't practice forgiveness, you may be the one who pays most dearly. By embracing forgiveness, you embrace peace, hope, gratitude and joy. Here, Katherine M. Piderman, Ph.D., staff chaplain at Mayo Clinic, Rochester, Minn., discusses forgiveness and how it can lead you down the path of physical, emotional and spiritual well-being. 

*What is forgiveness?*
There's no one definition of forgiveness. But in general, forgiveness is a decision to let go of resentments and thoughts of revenge. Forgiveness is the act of untying yourself from thoughts and feelings that bind you to the offense committed against you. This can reduce the power these feelings otherwise have over you, so that you can a live freer and happier life in the present. Forgiveness can even lead to feelings of understanding, empathy and compassion for the one who hurt you. 

*Doesn't forgiving someone mean you're forgetting or condoning what happened?*
Absolutely not! Forgiving isn't the same as forgetting what happened to you. The act that hurt or offended you may always remain a part of your life. But forgiveness can lessen its grip on you and help you focus on other, positive parts of your life. Forgiveness also doesn't mean that you deny the other person's responsibility for hurting you, and it doesn't minimize or justify the wrong. You can forgive the person without excusing the act. 

*What are the benefits of forgiving someone?*
Researchers have recently become interested in studying the effects of being unforgiving and being forgiving. Evidence is mounting that holding on to grudges and bitterness results in long-term health problems. Forgiveness, on the other hand, offers numerous benefits, including: 


Lower blood pressure 
Stress reduction 
Less hostility 
Better anger management skills 
Lower heart rate 
Lower risk of alcohol or substance abuse 
Fewer depression symptoms 
Fewer anxiety symptoms 
Reduction in chronic pain 
More friendships 
Healthier relationships 
Greater religious or spiritual well-being 
Improved psychological well-being
*Why do we hold grudges and become resentful and unforgiving?*
The people most likely to hurt us are those closest to us ? our partners, friends, siblings and parents. When we're hurt by someone we love and trust ? whether it's a lie, betrayal, rejection, abuse or insult ? it can be extremely difficult to overcome. And even minor offenses can turn into huge conflicts. When you experience hurt or harm from someone's actions or words, whether this is intended or not, you may begin experiencing negative feelings such as anger, confusion or sadness, especially when it's someone close to you. These feelings may start out small. But if you don't deal with them quickly, they can grow bigger and more powerful. They may even begin to crowd out positive feelings. Grudges filled with resentment, vengeance and hostility take root when you dwell on hurtful events or situations, replaying them in your mind many times. Soon, you may find yourself swallowed up by your own bitterness or sense of injustice. You may feel trapped and may not see a way out. It's very hard to let go of grudges at this point and instead you may remain resentful and unforgiving. 

*How do I know it's time to try to embrace forgiveness?*
When we hold on to pain, old grudges, bitterness and even hatred, many areas of our lives can suffer. When we're unforgiving, it's we who pay the price over and over. We may bring our anger and bitterness into every relationship and new experience. Our lives may be so wrapped up in the wrong that we can't enjoy the present. Other signs that it may be time to consider forgiveness include: 


Dwelling on the events surrounding the offense 
Hearing from others that you have a chip on your shoulder or that you're wallowing in self-pity 
Being avoided by family and friends because they don't enjoy being around you 
Having angry outbursts at the smallest perceived slights 
Often feeling misunderstood 
Drinking excessively, smoking or using drugs to try to cope with your pain 
Having symptoms of depression or anxiety 
Being consumed by a desire for revenge or punishment 
Automatically thinking the worst about people or situations 
Regretting the loss of a valued relationship 
Feeling like your life lacks meaning or purpose 
Feeling at odds with your religious or spiritual beliefs
The bottom line is that you may often feel miserable in your current life. 

*How do I reach a state of forgiveness?*
Forgiveness is a commitment to a process of change. It can be difficult and it can take time. Everyone moves toward forgiveness a little differently. One step is to recognize the value of forgiveness and its importance in our lives at a given time. Another is to reflect on the facts of the situation, how we've reacted, and how this combination has affected our lives, our health and our well-being. Then, as we are ready, we can actively choose to forgive the one who has offended us. In this way, we move away from our role as a victim and release the control and power the offending person and situation have had in our lives. Forgiveness also means that we change old patterns of beliefs and actions that are driven by our bitterness. As we let go of grudges, we'll no longer define our lives by how we've been hurt, and we may even find compassion and understanding. 

*What happens if I can't forgive someone?*
Forgiveness can be very challenging. It may be particularly hard to forgive someone who doesn't admit wrong or doesn't speak of their sorrow. Keep in mind that the key benefits of forgiveness are for you. If you find yourself stuck, it may be helpful to take some time to talk with a person you've found to be wise and compassionate, such as a spiritual leader, a mental health provider or an unbiased family member or friend. It may also be helpful to reflect on times you've hurt others and on those who have forgiven you. As you recall how you felt, it may help you to understand the position of the person who hurt you. It can also be beneficial to pray, use guided meditation or journal. In any case, if the intention to forgive is present, forgiveness will come in its time. 

*Does forgiveness guarantee reconciliation?*
Not always. In some cases, reconciliation may be impossible because the offender has died. In other cases, reconciliation may not be appropriate, especially if you were attacked or assaulted. But even in those cases, forgiveness is still possible, even if reconciliation isn't. On the other hand, if the hurtful event involved a family member or friend whose relationship you otherwise value, forgiveness may lead to reconciliation. This may not happen quickly, as you both may need time to re-establish trust. But in the end, your relationship may very well be one that is rich and fulfilling. 

*What if I have to interact with the person who hurt me but I don't want to?*
These situations are difficult. If the hurt involves a family member, it may not always be possible to avoid him or her entirely. You may be invited to the same family holiday gatherings, for instance. If you've reached a state of forgiveness, you may be able to enjoy these gatherings without bringing up the old hurts. If you haven't reached forgiveness, these gatherings may be tense and stressful for everyone, particularly if other family members have chosen sides in the conflict. 

So how do you handle this? First, remember that you do have a choice whether to attend or not attend family get-togethers. Respect yourself and do what seems best. If you choose to go, don't be surprised by a certain amount of awkwardness and perhaps even more intense feelings. It's important to keep an eye on those feelings. You don't want them to lead you to be unjust or unkind in return for what was done to you. Also, avoid drinking too much alcohol as a way to try to numb your feelings or feel better ? it'll likely backfire. And keep an open heart and mind. People do change, and perhaps the offender will want to apologize or make amends. You also may find that the gathering helps you to move forward with forgiveness. 

*How do I know when I've truly forgiven someone?*
Forgiveness may result in sincerely spoken words such as "I forgive you" or tender actions that fit the relationship. But more than this, forgiveness brings a kind of peace that helps you go on with life. The offense is no longer front and center in your thoughts or feelings. Your hostility, resentment and misery have made way for compassion, kindness and peace. Also, remember that forgiveness often isn't a one-time thing. It begins with a decision, but because memories or another set of words or actions may trigger old feelings, you may need to recommit to forgiveness over and over again. 

*What if the person I'm forgiving doesn't change?*
Getting the other person to change their actions, behavior or words isn't the point of forgiveness. In fact, the other person may never change or apologize for the offense. Think of forgiveness more about how it can change your life ? by bringing you more peace, happiness, and emotional and spiritual healing. Forgiveness takes away the power the other person continues to wield in your life. Through forgiveness, you choose to no longer define yourself as a victim. Forgiveness is done primarily for yourself, and less so for the person who wronged you. 

*What if I'm the one who needs forgiveness?*
It may help to spend some time thinking about the offense you've committed and trying to determine the effect it has had on others. Unless it may cause more harm or distress, consider admitting the wrong you've done to those you've harmed, speaking of your sincere sorrow or regret, and specifically asking for forgiveness ? without making excuses. But if this seems unwise because it may further harm or distress, don't do it ? it's not about making yourself feel better by apologizing. You don't want to add salt to a painful wound. Also, keep in mind that you can't force someone to forgive you. They will need to move to forgiveness in their own time. 

In any case, we have to be willing to forgive ourselves. Holding on to resentment against yourself can be just as toxic as holding on to resentment against someone else. Recognize that poor behavior or mistakes don't make you worthless or bad. Accept the fact that you ? like everyone else ? aren't perfect. Accept yourself despite your faults. Admit your mistakes. Commit to treating others with compassion, empathy and respect. And again, talking with a spiritual leader, mental health provider or trusted friend or relative may be helpful. 

Forgiveness of yourself or someone else, though not easy, can transform your life. Instead of dwelling on the injustice and revenge, instead of being angry and bitter, you can move toward a life of peace, compassion, mercy, joy and kindness.


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## brickhouse

what of you are always the one who is "forgiving"...or just letting things go?
i'm so tired...literally, of it...i don't know what to do or where to go. i'm caught in the middle, but really at my breaking point.


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## David Baxter PhD

Forgiving isn't necessarily about letting things go but rather finding another way to deal with them.

And often forgiving isn't even about another person - it's about you and finding peace.


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## Mark Shaw

This article really says a lot about the reality of myself and people who i am close to, and also people who i meet in life everyday. So many people constantly talk about an issue they have with someone else where this person or that person has offended them, never able to see that the problem can and should be the other persons.

A couple of my close friends regularly speak bitterly of occasions like this when someone has acted out of their social norm and offended them or their friends. And even though i remind them about where the source of the issue lies, they usually agree whilst looking bitter and confused.

It seems such a big part of life and is even portrayed on TV and in films. Hence when my parents rant on about how a celebrity or politician has said this or that about another celebrity, i suppose extended or virtual bitterness can be forgiven also.


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## Leo Lavoie

Sometimes forgiving seems to get in the way of therapy. As I point out to the patient that the source of his neurosis is the way his mother or father did this or that, then the forgiveness that the patient is so fond of is just a disguise for a defense mechanism.

That is to show how forgiveness is the result of a healing process as much as part of it. 

Logic and knowledge will do for rational forgiveness. The one who is offensing is almost always sure that he is defensing and that his "evil" actions are justified. Nevertheless, forgiveness does't wipe clean the slate of responsibility. 

In analytic psychotherapy, I teach my patients that they can forgive all they want or not; it changes nothing about the fact that their childhood surroundings of adults where responsible for his psychological well being. Did they fail or not? Usually, if the patient is not psychologically well, then, on at least some level, they did fail.  And it DID hurt. 

When this is deeply aknowledged then the healing can start and when the healing is done, then it is the perfect base for true forgiveness.


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## poohbear

I am in the middle of a very long and very frustrating divorce.  My ex has made some very harsh (and wholly untrue) comments that have gotten others involved in our divorce.  I am very, very angry with him.  I am wanting all of this to be over, but it seems that every week or so (while waiting for all of this to end) there is a new development that has to be addressed.  I WANT to (believe me I do) put all this behind me and to just GO ON in life.  But it seems I cannot.  Is there a way to FORCE oneself to forgive, despite constant reminders of hurt and betrayal--especially emotional hurt?--Poohbear


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## amastie

Thanks David,
Saved the article.
Wondered how I could perhap apply it to forgiving oneself.
Have to read it more carefully.


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## kimmy

I think that you can forgive someone while choosing to break the relationship. When you forgive, you do first and foremost 'FOR YOU' to you free up your grudges. But to get to forgive, you must be able to understand and feel, without trial and without charges. It is necessary to use empathy and you can feel how this person had reached its limits.


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## Budoaiki

I am still trying to find a way to forgive my father which is really hard because every time we talk (if you can call it that) he goes on the defensive and he agitates me to the point of anger which is one of the reasons why we aren't speaking. 

This article reminded me of the purpose of forgiveness and that it's not about having him justify his actions or getting an apology it's about finding peace of mind and learning to forgive myself.


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## Into The Light

David Baxter said:


> Forgiving isn't necessarily about letting things go but rather finding another way to deal with them.
> 
> And often forgiving isn't even about another person - it's about you and finding peace.



how do you do that?

does it need to be a conscious decision that you want to forgive and then you work on it?

can forgiveness happen gradually and on its own without actively trying to achieve it?


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## ladylore

> can forgiveness happen gradually and on its own without actively trying to achieve it?



This is how it happened for me.


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## MonaLachia

This was really helpful information David. Thanks for that.  I truly feel also that grudges and bitterness hurts you more so than the person or people you're holding bitterness or grudges towards.  What's crazy is sometimes the people who are holding grudges against the next person that person many times are totally unaware of it.  Which makes it even worse.


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## HBas

David Baxter said:


> Forgiving isn't necessarily about letting things go but rather finding another way to deal with them.
> 
> And often forgiving isn't even about another person - it's about you and finding peace.



I have always looked for a way to explain it but you have done that for me now Dr. Baxter - Thank you - I will keep it in my head.


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## Ryan Howes

Interesting stuff here, thanks David. I've got some interest in this topic, too (I wrote something about it a couple years ago). It seems to me that a lot of people ignore or under-emphasize the importance of emotion in forgiveness. I think this oversight is what makes forgiveness so difficult for many people. 

I think there are four elements necessary for healthy forgiveness:
  1. Express the emotion
  2. Rebuild security
  3. Understand
  4. Let go

Let's say you walk over and step on my foot. My first most responses are likely feelings: pain sensations, shock, anger. Then I wonder why you did it. Then I start planning how to make sure it'll never happen again. Only when the emotion has been fully expressed (preferably to you, but that's not always necessary), I have some understanding of why you did it (you're mad at me? you're clumsy? you're drunk? okay, I get it), and I have some assurance of safety (your promise not to do it again, my wearing steel-toed shoes, or deciding not to be in the same room as you), can I even think of letting go (deciding not to hold a grudge). 

I think too many people want to leapfrog over emotions and rush to forgiveness. It's difficult feeling hurt, sadness and anger, and even more difficult expressing it to the person who hurt you. But if the emotion isn't expressed, it will just sit and fester, and deep forgiveness won't take place. 

One more thing: some people have difficulty with the Letting Go part of forgiveness because holding a legitimate grudge is a powerful position, and forgiveness means becoming equals again. I see this with couples all the time. They won't drop their partner's mistake from a decade ago because it's a powerful weapon to haul out when they feel the need. "You're mad I didn't wash the dishes? Well, you forgot my birthday one year!" To forgive means making a decision to drop that grudge and never use it for ammunition again. And this is much easier when the emotions have been fully expressed.


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## David Baxter PhD

Ryan Howes said:


> I think too many people want to leapfrog over emotions and rush to forgiveness. It's difficult feeling hurt, sadness and anger, and even more difficult expressing it to the person who hurt you. But if the emotion isn't expressed, it will just sit and fester, and deep forgiveness won't take place.
> 
> One more thing: some people have difficulty with the Letting Go part of forgiveness because holding a legitimate grudge is a powerful position, and forgiveness means becoming equals again. I see this with couples all the time. They won't drop their partner's mistake from a decade ago because it's a powerful weapon to haul out when they feel the need. "You're mad I didn't wash the dishes? Well, you forgot my birthday one year!" To forgive means making a decision to drop that grudge and never use it for ammunition again. And this is much easier when the emotions have been fully expressed.



Both excellent points which are consistent with my own observations, perhaps especially the first in the case of couples. They want to move on with the relationship and therefore feel the need to get over the anger -> forgiveness part as quickly as possibly to avoid creating any further distance between them.


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## ladylore

> They want to move on with the relationship and therefore feel the need to get over the anger


 And doomed for failure. If the forgiveness isn't authentic the anger and other feelings will come back. Maybe in a more passive-agressive way, but they will come back.


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## Fiver

I hate this topic, I really do. I suppose that being brought up in a mostly Judeo-Christian society places a definition of "forgiveness" that makes it feel mandatory in polite company. I'm really struggling with this forgiveness crap right now, I really am.

Look, I'm an easy person to get alone with, and I'm an easier person to please. I happen to also believe that I have a large capacity for empathy and compassion, and as such I am more than willing to forgive and move forward when it's necessary. I've made more than my share of mistakes in my life, and I've been forgiven and offered the chance time and again to make things right. Hopefully, I've not let too many of those people down. But they taught me to do the same for others.

But forgiveness no matter what? Just because it's supposed to help me move on? Nope, not buying it. Let's take a specific example, the one with which I'm currently struggling. I was raped, beaten, and nearly killed by a man who had no reason to hate me, much less commit such atrocities. He never offered a reason to me or his other rape victims, never showed the slightest amount of remorse throughout his trial or his sentencing, and in fact continued to be cruel and disdainful to those he hurt (which included his wife and her daughter, who is my ex-significant other of more than a decade.)

I wasted the better part of the last fifteen months searching for some understanding of what would cause someone to become so cruel and evil, or mentally and criminally ill. I had hoped to be offered something resembling an apology, or at least glimpse a hint of remorse. In fact, I had it in my head for a long time that I needed to visit him while he was in jail awaiting trial, just to try to find some answers in his eyes. My therapist had a hard time talking me out of that one, but ultimately she was right: I will not find my answers in this man. He does not want forgiveness because he feels no remorse. 

How do you forgive someone who feels no remorse, and doesn't care one way or the other if you forgive him or not? And why should I forgive someone who is not asking me for the chance to make amends? Will forgiving him make me feel better? Hell no! It took me this long to get angry and to feel some needed hatred toward him -- and now forgiving him is supposed to make me feel better?

No. It's not going to happen. I'm not Jesus Christ and I don't have to forgive anyone if I don't want to, not for them and not for me, not when they don't desire it. In time I can envision my anger and hatred waning to a healthy level, I really can see that happening as I continue to move forward. But he does not deserve my forgiveness, nor do I feel I have to give him one more thing that he hasn't already taken by force.

If there is a god that this bastard believes in, and he chooses to ask his god for forgiveness, then good for him. But I'm human, he hasn't asked me, and he's not getting it. This is one thing I get to keep.

[Geeze, I'm sorry -- did I just derail another thread?]


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## David Baxter PhD

No, not at all, Fiver.

There are times when forgiveness is beneficial.

There are times when it is probably impossible and probably neither necessary or helpful. 

In a case such as you describe, I wouldn't even try to encourage forgiveness. Why and how would someone even begin to forgive something like that or a person who had done something like that? In such cases, I think the goal is more one of coping and acknowledging the victimization instead of searching for responsibility for that victimization.


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## Jazzey

Ditto Fiver..Better yet, how do you forgive yourself (not intended for you) but certainly a question that creeps up on me daily because of my own circumstances...I don't know....

:hug::hug:


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## Cat Dancer

Forgiveness to me is not at all about the other person. To me it's about being able to truly let go of the hold the other person has on my life. So maybe the word forgiveness isn't really even accurate. I think it's more a letting go or a cleansing of this person out of my life.  

And everyone views it differently. Everyone's experiences and lives are different. For me, some kind of forgiveness will be necessary for me to move on. That's just my own personal belief. If someone else thinks differently there's nothing wrong with that either.


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## Jazzey

Thank you CD..For the time being, it's me that I just can't forgive.  Not even the rapist - funny huh?
:hug::hug:

Life's funny in its dichotomies...


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## Fiver

David Baxter said:


> No, not at all, Fiver.
> 
> There are times when forgiveness is beneficial.
> 
> There are times when it is probably impossible and probably neither necessary or helpful.
> 
> In a case such as you describe, I wouldn't even try to encourage forgiveness. Why and how would someone even begin to forgive something like that or a person who had done something like that? In such cases, I think the goal is more one of coping and acknowledging the victimization instead of searching for responsibility for that victimization.



Aye, thank you for that. I think that the accepted definition of what constitutes "forgiveness" and what it's really supposed to mean (whatever that is,) gets all confusalated with my Roman Catholic upbringing. Therefore I'm having to "unlearn" some things about what is truly required of me to be a good person. This is one more of those ties I'm breaking to move on with my life.

I appreciate that you validated my feelings, Dr. DJB. They've been hard to feel, much less express, and I still feel guilty for feeling the hatred and anger. The gentle reminders that it's really okay to feel what I feel are still necessary, unfortunately. Thank you for the nudge.



Jazzey said:


> Ditto Fiver..Better yet, how do you forgive yourself (not intended for you) but certainly a question that creeps up on me daily because of my own circumstances...I don't know....
> 
> :hug::hug:



In this case -- and I believe you are referring to the way we, as victims, continue to blame ourselves for what happened -- the answer is simple and complicated, if not seemingly impossible, at the same time.

The simple answer? There is no need for us to forgive ourselves for what happened. Even if there was potentially _something_ we could have done to mitigate the damage someone else caused, the fact remains that _we did not cause the damage, nor did we intend for damage to be caused_.  With this knowledge, it should be easy to see that we have no need for forgive ourselves, because we did NOTHING WRONG, and we did NOTHING TO DESERVE IT.

But this is not how your brain thinks, nor is it how mine thinks (although I'm getting closer to seeing the light, maybe.) So if you'll let me take myself out of the equation and offer an objective opinion, I say to you this: 

You do not need to forgive yourself for anything. What you need is give yourself some much needed kindness and quit kicking yourself for something that is _*entirely*_ the fault of someone else. 

Yes, we both might have done things differently, knowing what we know now. That's great, just in case, you know, the exact same circumstances ever come up again. _We did what we did with what we had at the time_, J.  For all either of us knows, we might have handled our respective situations far better than anyone else would have under the same circumstances. 

What I do know is that we didn't deserve it, we didn't ask for it, and we did nothing that requires forgiveness here. Nothing. From anyone. Stop smacking yourself around for someone else's atrocious acts. 

Please?


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## Jazzey

Thank you Fiver.  :hug::friends::heart:  From the bottom of my heart.


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## David Baxter PhD

Jazzey said:


> Ditto Fiver..Better yet, how do you forgive yourself (not intended for you) but certainly a question that creeps up on me daily because of my own circumstances...I don't know....



That was my point: That's sometimes a lot more important.


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## David Baxter PhD

Cat Dancer said:


> Forgiveness to me is not at all about the other person. To me it's about being able to truly let go of the hold the other person has on my life. So maybe the word forgiveness isn't really even accurate. I think it's more a letting go or a cleansing of this person out of my life.



Exactly! Very well put, CD! :2thumbs:


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## Fiver

Yup, I think the definition of the word "forgiveness" has a lot to do with how each of us deals with it. Different cultures are going to think of it in different ways, just like the way the word "victim" has taken on connotations of negativity.

CD nails it. It's about letting go, moving on, and breaking whatever ties are necessary to do it. 

This is a confusing and exhausting topic. I need to go off and search for some levity now.


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## DrMikeMiller

Good article.  Something most of us need to work on!


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## sadhana13

Thanks for the message, I'm following it. I'm practising affirmation, 'since it is unhelpful to carry baggage let go of it.'


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## songsforthedeaf

i had trouble with this for awhile and actually yoga helped me


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## getxtina

I've had a traumatic experience with a nanny who locks me inside the bathroom with no lights on whenever she thinks I misbehaved. I was 5 for pete's sake. I never attempted to forget but I guess I forgave.


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## Futurepower3000

but..Who are we to forgive?  Forgive what? Don't we all have issues and errors.. I think the work has to be in ourselves, beyone all this drama?and try learn to leave behind the need to forgive! That?s a winner for me.


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## Peter

I think there are two basic ways to be, either you are fearful or loving. When loving, there is nothing to forgive. When fearful, forgiveness is sought. I have not yet evolved to full enlightenment where life is lived fearlessly and unconditionally. I get caught up with human ignorance and experience resentments that seek forgiveness. When that happens, and after I had enough of it, I get reminded of a powerful method to overcome it. I pray for the person, place, thing or situation which I resent. It may sound like a crazy thing to do, but it works. My prayer may go like this: ?I pray that ?. will become enlightened, see the truth, and become fearless to love unconditionally.? My sincere prayer also reminds me of the deeper truths, and then suddenly, I realize there is nothing to forgive.


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## Futurepower3000

Peter said:


> I think there are two basic ways to be, either you are fearful or loving. When loving, there is nothing to forgive. When fearful, forgiveness is sought. I have not yet evolved to full enlightenment where life is lived fearlessly and unconditionally. I get caught up with human ignorance and experience resentments that seek forgiveness. When that happens, and after I had enough of it, I get reminded of a powerful method to overcome it. I pray for the person, place, thing or situation which I resent. It may sound like a crazy thing to do, but it works. My prayer may go like this: ?I pray that ?. will become enlightened, see the truth, and become fearless to love unconditionally.? My sincere prayer also reminds me of the deeper truths, and then suddenly, I realize there is nothing to forgive.



BINGO!:2thumbs:


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## myjade84

How do we know if we already forgive someone? I hate somebody because he done something bad to me. I hate him all my life but i told myself that i already forgave him even if he didn't ask for forgiveness. The psychologist also advised me to forgive him and let go of the past and pain. But whenever i see him or just hear his voice, my anger rises up again.


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## HBas

Wow that is a tough question. Personally,I believe that it is like anything in life that gets easier with time and practice. I am struggling to forgive my ex but I wake up every day giving him a hug in my head because people that get it over their hearts to hurt other people must be broken in some way whether they acknowledge it or not. So, to remind myself that I am above hurting I give him a hug (in my head) and try to last a tad longer in peace mode than the previous day.

I heard it described so well once when someone was asked why do they go to church if they cannot remember the sermons. He answered that he has supper every night and though he cannot remember what his wife has cooked every night for the past 20 years, it has kept him fed, strong and healthy. Like with the body, the same is true for the mind and the soul. Going to church has kept his soul fed, strong and healthy. 

I have incorporated that thinking to try and keep my mind healthy too. It may be easier said than done but I think continuously trying and trying and trying may seem fruitless when you don't see the results after a while but in the end it might be keeping your thoughts fed positively which in time might just make it stronger
and healthier. 

Just a thought. Keep on trying ... I struggle with this every day.

Take care!


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## myjade84

Thank you for the reply HBas. I also struggle with my pain everyday. There are days that i don't know what to do and just wanted to scream. My hatred seems like a big wall that surrounds me and makes me remember not to trust anyone. I don't have much friends so i don't go out. Ever since i was young, i feel like i am not really normal. There's something wrong with me. The psychologist said i am prone to abuse because i am loner and just like to sit in a corner and observe everyone. I envy those are born normally and happy with their lives. Sigh...I wish i am like them too. I am already in this condition when 1 person hurts me so bad. That's when i tried to kill myself. Luckily i was saved but ever since i can't stop thinking of killing myself. It's hard to live in this wrong world especially living with those bad people. I wish to God i can forget everything and be healed.


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## Budoaiki

Myjade84,

Personally I've found thinking of the world as good or bad can create unrealistic expectations and similarly with people. I think people do things with good and bad intentions but I try not to think of people of people as strictly good or bad because I find that feeds my anger and breeds self doubt. Undoubtedly there are combative people who seek out those who are suffering to victamise them for a power trip because of their own insecuraties that in my opinion is their weakness. 

Sometimes we can't avoid those types of people because we have to interact with them at work, in our family, where we live lika neighbor or throughout the course of the day.

I view these combative people as insecure and the various forms of aggression as acts of desperation from this perspective I find compassion and forgiveness. It doesn't erase the harm or cause them to change but it helps prevent the internal conflict and doubt that these actions can cause which can also prevent anger from becoming vindictive towards them. That also can help prevent the anger from causing guilt and that cycle which can cause anger to snowball which through stress can cause us to be more vulnerable to these types of actions.

If the person knows what they did or not, if they are willing to apologize or not, if they demonstrate any compassion or not, these things have helped me to forgive, not to forget or condone anything but to be at peace with myself and my own feelings regardless of the actions of others.


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## myjade84

Budoaiki said:


> Myjade84,
> 
> Personally I've found thinking of the world as good or bad can create unrealistic expectations and similarly with people. I think people do things with good and bad intentions but I try not to think of people of people as strictly good or bad because I find that feeds my anger and breeds self doubt. Undoubtedly there are combative people who seek out those who are suffering to victamise them for a power trip because of their own insecuraties that in my opinion is their weakness.
> 
> Sometimes we can't avoid those types of people because we have to interact with them at work, in our family, where we live lika neighbor or throughout the course of the day.
> 
> I view these combative people as insecure and the various forms of aggression as acts of desperation from this perspective I find compassion and forgiveness. It doesn't erase the harm or cause them to change but it helps prevent the internal conflict and doubt that these actions can cause which can also prevent anger from becoming vindictive towards them. That also can help prevent the anger from causing guilt and that cycle which can cause anger to snowball which through stress can cause us to be more vulnerable to these types of actions.
> 
> If the person knows what they did or not, if they are willing to apologize or not, if they demonstrate any compassion or not, these things have helped me to forgive, not to forget or condone anything but to be at peace with myself and my own feelings regardless of the actions of others.



Thank you Budoiki. I know i have to handle this well so i can interact with people normally. But right now it's very hard for me to do so. I am trying harder to think positively everyday and not to let my dark thoughts win over me. I know not everyone is bad but i just don't want to be hurt again. Trusting someone again would be a little difficult as of now.


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## Budoaiki

Myjade84,

It's not an easy thing to trust, I struggle with that myself especially when stressed no real easy answer. I try to take it one interaction at a time and build up trust for and with people. Even with therapy I had a hard time opening up because previously when people got to know me and all I have been through they expect more anger which don't get me wrong I had plenty of and struggled with it but I've also seen what it can do to the person and the people around them.

I don't know if that's the case with you but for me I was afraid of my anger, I was...and still am but to a lesser degree of people getting to know me, caring about me and that pity often came when people asked about my family. 

The thing is if I am honest with myself, brutally honest then yes I been through some pretty hard times in my life and I have some scars from it but like everyone who's had to overcome trauma and or had struggles there's is so much more to me than that. The things we go through the struggles and suffering they may leave scars but they also provide insights, unique perspectives that allow us to see things others may not and we each deserve friendship and love. 

It's not easy but with patience, work and practice it does get easier and through the perspective of others you can see things you have to offer that you might not know are there.


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## myjade84

Budoaiki, thank you so much. Your words reached me. I'm crying a bit right now. Yes, we deserve to be loved like everyone else. But i am wondering why they couldn't give us the love we truly deserve and yet give it to normal people so easily. We are the ones that should be understood and taken care of and yet we are always the people who are ignored and left behind in a corner while everyone is having fun.
It's not our fault to have this illness but when i look at their eyes (my family), i can see that they are blaming me. This is the reason why i couldn't stand looking at other people's eyes when i talk with them and it made my condition worse.


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## Rozi95

It was so interesting to read. I've heard once that if you blame someone for something and you can't forgive him, you may write on a list of a paper that you forgive him hundreds of times, and it will help. Do you thing that it really can help or it's just a theory?


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## MHealthJo

I am not sure Rozi.... I think it would depend on the situation....

As all the different comments in the thread highlight as well, 'forgiveness' is a complex word, and 'forgiveness' in its usual sense is not always quite the right goal for absolutely every situation... it varies depending on the situation....

I will say though that repeating of affirmations and thoughts has sometimes been helpful to me...

If the situation is as resolved as it is ever going to get, and you have explored and experienced as much as possible of the healing/repair process as the thread comments describe, then I could imagine that over time writing down a thought like "I am letting go of this a little more with time." could be somewhat helpful...

Feel free also to post further if you would like to, or to ask other questions you may have.


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## Harebells

Hi Rozi,
I read this book recently and found it very helpful (despite the cheesy cover) The Tao of Fully Feeling: Harvesting Forgiveness Out of Blame: Pete Walker: 9780964299603: Amazon.com: Books. It's about how we need to fully feel and acknowledge the harm that someone has done to us and our anger and sadness about it (not necessarily confronting them, unless it helps to) and forgiveness will arise naturally at some point, although it's fluid and may come and go and feel stronger at some times more than others, but eventually will become more of a default position. He says false/forced/premature forgiveness can do harm and interfere with our sense of self protection. I'm not articulating it very well but it's a good book!


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## MHealthJo

Yes, those are very accurate messages from that book, Harebells. I think you have summarised very well how this emotional process works.


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## Potcake

I know there is no one answer, one perfect solution for everyone, but I just wish somebody could give a real life, concrete step of something I can do to forgive. I've read and read and read, and intellectually I recognize that this is what I need to do...but something inside says, I just want to stay mad a little longer. I feel I suffered under his rule of law for many years so I can't expect it to vanish after I blythly say "I forgive you" . I can make it sound convincing, and I can fool family & friends into thinking how amazing I am that I have come this far, but when I am alone I just want to scream at him and berate him for all the twisted things he has said and continues to say about me. I know this anger is eating away at me. I am so happy to be on my own, now settled into a peaceful place, miles away from him, but I continue to torture myself by looking at his pictures and reading about all the wonderful things he is doing...without me...even though I don't want to be there. It will be a year next week that he forced me out of our home, although he frames it as me "dumping" him, and still I sit here wallowing in sadness, anger, frustration, hurt, envy & regrets. Why on earth can't I move on?


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## MHealthJo

I'm so sorry for what you have experienced, Potcake.

As the thread comments go into, a wrong and a hurt almost always must be very definitely processed fully first, before real relief from the feelings and real moving on can happen. 

Depending on the situation, quite often work with a skilled and compassionate therapist regarding what has happened, is needed for this processing to actually occur.

Wondering if that is something that you might have an opportunity to get access to?


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## Potcake

MHealthJo said:


> I'm so sorry for what you have experienced, Potcake.
> 
> As the thread comments go into, a wrong and a hurt almost always must be very definitely processed fully first, before real relief from the feelings and real moving on can happen.
> 
> Depending on the situation, quite often work with a skilled and compassionate therapist regarding what has happened, is needed for this processing to actually occur.
> 
> Wondering if that is something that you might have an opportunity to get access to?




I am not sure. I certainly can't afford to pay for therapy, as he still controls the purse strings but I think it is time for me to pursue what therapy might be available within our health system. I've been procrastinating.


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## MHealthJo

Hope that something comes through for you, Potcake. It's definitely a difficult thing to start moving towards the steps we can take, when we are still reeling and hurting so much from something. One of those catch-22 situations!

Different health systems in different places sometimes have a few different options or avenues, and resources like medical centres, charities, universities, and other places sometimes have insight or can point us in a direction of options we might not be aware of. Sometimes private therapists are willing to work on a sliding-scale basis too, and also some online options have started to develop although I don't know much about them. Hope that something will come through for you and you will receive the compassion and healing that you need Potcake, so don't give up, and also if you get stuck sometimes members or resources here might have further suggestions or avenues to explore. Kind wishes for healing to you...


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