# It scares me



## forgetmenot (Dec 14, 2009)

It scares me how frequently my thoughts go back to here to this option.

Inside me knows it really does know that i really should be somehow getting help to stop this but then i think no let it ride if it takes me away then so be it.
I hate this hearing phone ringing god when its not its my fear that i will get a call again but this time she will have accomplished it.  I don't want to be here for that.
Logically logically i am trying to think so hard maybe too hard god i see and hear all the instability in her she is not stable calling me wanting money calling swearing i don't know how to say no to her.

if i was not here she would have no option but to grow up  i just think it would be for the best
i have told my husband and twin now what i want to do i am not coping but they don't hear or believe me
I have had a plan now for awhile and was to have finished it by now oh but i just couldn't do it. 

My fear is it will only take one more attack from anyone and i am triggered and it will be done  The pain will be my catalyst it always is.
Suicide is never the answer but when the pain overides rational thoughts it does scare me it really does knowing how close i have come.


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## Lana (Dec 14, 2009)

Hi Violet;

I was just reading your post and these lines caught my attention:


Violet said:


> i don't know how to say no to her.
> if i was not here she would have no option but to grow up  i just think it would be for the best


I wonder if this is the crux of the problem here.  But I wanted to ask you: do you think if you learned to say "no" to her, that it would take away the suicidal thoughts?  If so, sounds to me like it's the easier, less painful and most productive way for all.  What do you think?


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## Jazzey (Dec 14, 2009)

I'm happy that you didn't act on your thoughts, Violet.  Both your daughter and your twin still need you - not to mention your other family members.  Don't ever leave them with such a memory of your last days. You deserve better than that - you deserve peace and happiness...Just, not this way, ok?


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## forgetmenot (Dec 14, 2009)

I don't understand the guilt the fear these emotions of total self hate  I say no and she attacks so viciously oh god oh god she puts be back to a time i don't want to be. 

she becomes that attacker oh god i just want it to stop so i do what is necessary to make it all stop   I want her to stop attacking me i want her.  i don't know nothing makes sense there is no logic here no logic  I say no and she makes me pay she does in ways it just destroys me. If i am not here she would not have that control i would not be victimized again.

so easy to just say no no no but not easy to pick up pieces afterwards  i am not making sense now iam lost  again i just know i cannot keep this up.  I would do anything for this child anything oh god i just want her happy and well.  I can't give her that i can't give her stability i am a failure yes i tried so hard to not do anything wrong i see no other way i see no other way

---------- Post added at 10:38 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:34 PM ----------

Im sorry suicide not the answer im sorry i just want the pain to stop please im just confuse okay just totally confused


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## Jazzey (Dec 14, 2009)

Yes.  It is hard Violet.  But, one of the things I've slowly learned is this whole idea that we need to take care of ourselves -no one will do it for us...

Your daughter -she's just angry right now.  I have the same kind of relationship with my own mother.  We've been estranged for a little while, for a variety of reasons.  But, my father's dying right now - so I reached out to her once again. And, let me tell you - she's bitterly angry.

It's easy to get sucked into those kind of 'emotional' anger fests.  Especially when your own self-esteem is a little weak...But, at the end of the day - it's not about us - it really is about them.  As an individual, you need to do what keeps you safe - lean on your husband.  He is you life partner - lean on him.

As for your daughter - it's a moment of anger, bitterness - that's all.  She'll get over it.  YOu need to learn to phase it out somehow Violet.  She has her own issues - the bulk of which, despite her claims against you - really have nothing to do with you.

As hard as it is at times...Sometimes we just need to remember to take care of us first - otherwise, we're of no use to anyone else...

Suicidal ideation - I understand.  It's such an 'easy' way out at times.  I think you're worth the fight...For you, for your happiness.


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## Jazzey (Dec 14, 2009)

It's ok to be confused Violet - nothing wrong there.For the past few days I've been struggling too.It's ok to go down that thought process.  But,  I really do believe you shouldn't do it...you still need to get better, find out you you are as an individual-and , go from there.  That's the sequence I see for you...


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## Lana (Dec 14, 2009)

Violet said:


> i don't know nothing makes sense there is no logic here no logic  I say no and she makes me pay she does in ways it just destroys me. If i am not here she would not have that control i would not be victimized again.



One of the reasons things are not making sense is that it seems as if "she" is your savior and tormentor at the same time.  That designation assigns a LOT of responsibility to her....it also empowers her with tremendous control over you, Violet.  She, I am assuming, is a child...your child.  Maybe the roles need to be redefined: you the parent, in control...and she the child, in your charge....not the other way around.  For that, you'd need to see someone and do a bit of work.  That would also include saying "no" and dealing with any outbursts that may follow...and they will.  But you know what?  It's ok....if she learns that they no longer have an effect on you...she will stop.  You have to start with you.


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## forgetmenot (Dec 14, 2009)

Yes i agree totally i am at fault for her behavior.  Her outburst i can deal with it is her attempt of suicide which follow the attacks that i cannot cope with. 
It is her way of letting me know and it is effective.
  I will give her the dam money because if i don't she will make me pay and right now i have no feasible energy what so ever to deal with her and her after effects 
 I was stable when she was here with me because i could watch her and make sure no harm would come to her.  I can't protect her from herself when she is so far away.

---------- Post added at 11:06 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:58 PM ----------

I am sorry your father is not well and that your mother is angry with you. You are going through a lot Jazzey  I hope you have lots of friends to help you.  You are right Jazzey i cannot hurt anyone not intentionally  Please stay strong Jazzey i hope you have a therapist who can help you as well.  take care i will be okay.


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## Lana (Dec 14, 2009)

No, Violet.  I did not say you're at fault for her behavior.  What I said is that she knows that her tactics work and she uses them, to the full extent.  But are you not doing the same when you're considering suicide as a way of not dealing?  It's as if the two of you have a race on who does it first...and it's heartbreaking, for EVERYONE.  Someone has to stop first, and it is my sincere hope that you take that first step and not think of suicide as a way out.


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## forgetmenot (Dec 15, 2009)

I would never intentionally use suicide no as i do not want to harm others do not want to pass on this pain.  My fear is when pain overides all rational thoughts it is when it seems i need a way out a way to stop it  I become not me anymore i get so confused and there is such a battle going on   I can't explain it but you are right suicide cannot be the answer as it causes too much pain for others.  I pray i have the strength to call for help but so far i have been able to fight and win against the pain.  It is my fault her behavior i have never been strong in that way.  She knows when and where to hit  It is not her fault none of this is her doing she is my daughter and i will never ever stop caring for her no matter how hard she makes it  i will never oh god never give her away lock her out call her horrible things  I will not become them  i have to go now sorry  but know suicide is never the answer right never.

---------- Post added at 03:34 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:30 AM ----------

I did something today to try to pull me out of all this  I bought 2 things one a mirror a beautiful one  i wasn't going to buy it but my husband kept insisting that i never did anything for me  and i remembered what was said here. so i said okay and bought it something i never do i buy things for me. It was a weird feeling doing this and i feel some guilt but i think it is beautiful...    The second thing i bought was spontaneous. it was like a trigger sending my mind back again to a time when i was happy i remember having one didn't know who bought it for me but remember happiness.  It was strawberry shortcake on a stick  No way my mom could afford this   It was expensive even today because i bought a whole box of them from mm store  i ate two right away   It was crazy how i remember the feeling associated with this icecream i remember  the child who was happy not sad happy 
even this positive trigger tended to bring fatigue afterwards   I wish i could remember who bought it who was kind but i can't   I will try to be more kind to me if it helps keep me away from the negative thoughts  It is hard though as it was something never done others always had to come first.   sorry for writing my thoughts down  i just want you to know i am hearing what  you say  be good to me sometimes right  hopefully i will feel better soon. thanks


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## Lana (Dec 15, 2009)

Violet, that is fantastic!!!  I'm very proud of you!! You're on the right track so keep doing things that make you happy.  Soon, it'll become second nature and give you the strength and power that you've been seeking.


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## Banned (Dec 15, 2009)

Hi Violet,

I read this thread and am glad you are seeking other solutions besides suicide.  Suicide can seem so appealing in the moment when everything else is so overwhelming.  Unfortunately, we never get the chance to truly effect change in our life when we have chosen suicide as the solution.  

I noticed how your words run together  - it's not a criticism but rather an observation.  I have to assume your brain is also going at warp speed.  This can be dangerous because it can lead to impulsive decisions that are not good decisions.  Do you have someone who can help you learn to slow these thoughts down and maybe help you with some deep breathing and awareness exercises?  These can be helpful to collect your thoughts and bring things back into focus.  Again - not a criticism but just an observation.

I'm glad you found some strawberry shortcake on a stick.  Sometimes a little splurging is nice.  It sounds like you give so much of yourself to your family - taking a little something back for you is ok too.  

Take care.


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## forgetmenot (Dec 16, 2009)

Your observation is correct my mind does run away with me sometimes.  The thoughts come out faster than i can write.  I have my therapist i go to every 2 week.  It seems so long between sessions i wish i could go every week but it would get too expensive as i am only covered for 8 sessions the rest i pay.
 I feel bad as it is for spending money on me but i have to if i am to continue on this healing process. 
 My therapist is dealing with past and has taught me breathing in the box i just have to remember to do it.
  My thoughts have calm down a bit now as the sadness is here not anxiety.  I will continue to try to stay well thats all one can do right.   thanks for your post and your observations


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## forgetmenot (Dec 27, 2009)

I did not understand when you said she was my savior and tormentor at the same time. I think i understand now what was being said.  Somehow this connection between us has to be severed somehow because the pain is to great. The flashbacks oh the triggers somehow i need to do this but each time we seperate it ends so badly.  She does not cope she just does not cope.  Oh and i become so unstable  I wish to god we could just learn to live separately.  Her pain becomes mine somehow i become someone else   a someone i left behind.  I don't want to be her anymore.  Its okay mary its okay. thats all i keep saying its okay but i know its not okay.  I know its only going to get worse   ohohoh someday there will be healing there will be peace i hope soon as the pain is starting to have more power now. Logic dam it where is it when one needs it.


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## Jazzey (Dec 27, 2009)

Violet, tonight I'm going to be blunt - you need to take care of yourself.  No one else will do it for you.  I have a twin, as you know.  I can only influence my twin as he wishes.  At the end of the day, I need to take care of me, because no one else will do it for me - I've learned that in the past year (hard lesson).  I have to care about me - draw boundaries to make this feasible.  

Human nature is such that we're instinctively selfish.   It's not necessarily 'romantic' but, it is what it is.

For now, my twin has to be on the sidelines, for my own health.  It doesn't diminish my love for him - it just means that I'm willing to recognize just how fragile I've been recently.  And, moreover, I'm willing to place myself above others -irrespective of hurt feelings, hurt pride - my life depends on it.

Violet, it's ok to love your twin.  It's not ok to sacrifice your mental / physical health for her.  At some point, this life has to be fulfilling for 'us'.


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## forgetmenot (Dec 27, 2009)

I don't know how to seperate from my twin from my daughter from my family i don't know how.

I have always been a care giver always Jazzey since i was small. I kept the peace i looked after them i remember trying so hard to keep them safe to keep  I just don't know how to be anything else but a carer. Put myself above them put my pain infront of theirs it doesn't make sense  I am so confused because i think if they are stable then i will be stable  If i get calm then i will be calm  My successes come when everyone is safe.  Does this make sense Jazzey do i make sense or am i just as crazy as i feel i am.   I want the pain to stop i want this past to go away i don't want to be her anymore.   I am fighting to seperate not only from my twin but from my daughter  i am too tired for this  i am too tired.  

Put myself first then they will make me pay do you understand.  Im sorry i am so weak and tired  and i just want the past to go away   I hate myself so much  ihate where i am   I was a somebody  I was important  i showed them all now i am tired   I have nothing more to prove to anybody.


They were all wrong Jazzey they were all wrong because i became someone but now with all these flashbacks i am becoming the no one again  i don't want to go back anymore. sorry i am all over the place my mind sorry if i could seperate from my twin from my daugter i would   because i am no good to anyone anymore not like this  i am too unstable there is no logic dam it there is only pain.


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## Jazzey (Dec 27, 2009)

Violet said:


> I don't know how to seperate from my twin from my daughter from my family i don't know how.
> I have always been a care giver always Jazzey since i was small. I kept the peace i looked after them i remember trying so hard to keep them safe to keep  I just don't know how to be anything else but a carer. Put myself above them put my pain infront of theirs it doesn't make sense  I am so confused because i think if they are stable then i will be stable  If i get calm then i will be calm  My successes come when everyone is safe.



Ah yes, the hero syndrome...I carried that with me for a number of years...To my own detriment.
Violet, I had a mentor say to me "Cat, take care of yourself because no one else will".  She was right.

We can't change our families (unfortunately).  As for your daughter, forgive my candour -but you are enabling her - period.  It's ok to want to be a mediator - but only when the listener is willing to learn. Violet, your family is beyond that.  For now, focus on your own mental health. It's honestly not being selfish - it's self-preservation, and that's ok.  It took me the better part of 40 years to finally understand that we can't always change people (hard lesson), we can't make them love us when they just don't...So, we move forward, we learn our lessons and, more importantly, we stand by our own truths.  Stand by your truths, Violet. If those around you aren't ready to hear it, it's ok - it will still give you the power you need to be a survivor, a champion in all of this...I promise.



> Does this make sense Jazzey do i make sense or am i just as crazy as i feel i am.   I want the pain to stop i want this past to go away i don't want to be her anymore.   I am fighting to seperate not only from my twin but from my daughter  i am too tired for this  i am too tired.  Put myself first then they will make me pay do you understand.  Im sorry i am so weak and tired  and i just want the past to go away   I hate myself so much  ihate where i am   I was a somebody  I was important  i showed them all now i am tired   I have nothing more to prove to anybody
> They were all wrong Jazzey they were all wrong because i became someone but now with all these flashbacks i am becoming the no one again  i don't want to go back anymore. sorry i am all over the place my mind sorry if i could seperate from my twin from my daugter i would   because i am no good to anyone anymore not like this  i am too unstable there is no logic dam it there is only pain.


You do make sense...Now, time to let go of all this *crap* and focus on your well-being...It doesn't necessarily sound Christian - but, we can be of no help to anyone else until and unless we are solid...:hug:


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## forgetmenot (Dec 27, 2009)

Your right i am of no help to them not now.  My twin has come along way she has god love her she is trying.  My daughter is so young she has time to learn from others from professionals.  i do hear  you take care of me  I phone made an earlier appt as i know i need stability before anything i need stability.  I see therapist in 3 days i hope things stabalize soon.

I enable her i gave my daughter to the professionals she has to learn there. she is trying i take her back tommorrow maybe i will be better when she has returned to professionals who will teach her properly.  thanks for response Jazzey i just need to deal with all the pain that's all.  It is the past it will remain there i am not going back again. take care and thanks  I will continue to try to heal me first.


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## Jazzey (Dec 27, 2009)

Violet, I'm happy to hear that you're taking care of yourself.  But, you and I both know that you still need to revisit the past to be ok.  Like you, I'm not necessarily enthusiastic about revisiting the past-but, it is a necessary evil to get better. You have a lifetime ahead of you - be the model example for your daughter, please.  Do the work that is requisite for your mental health.  And, I'll follow my own advice - I promise.  I do have memories.  I really wish that I didn't have to revisit them - but, in order to be me again, it is a necessary evil...

Violet, please be an example for your daughter.  Show her that mental health is feasible when we're willing...:hug:


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## forgetmenot (Dec 27, 2009)

I have been doing this revisiting   I have and you see me now i am unstable   I am this weak pathetic nothing i hate her   I get so dam confused because i know it is not me  i am not her
Revisiting the past these emotions ohoh you become not you and it is not right to make me live there again. It is cruel to bring up such painful thoughts and make me live through them. 
I would never cause anyone this kind of pain it is cruel.   Revisit something someone that just didn't matter  why why be so cruel to me why    You say it is necessary to heal to feel these emotions  why why i say is any of it necessary not when i have succeeded  I have become someone i am someone and i will not go back to being her again.  This whole idea of looking backwards of remembering  i am trying and as for my daughter she will heal now because the professionals will heal her  i am no enabling her i am walking away from it all.
i have to energy to enable anyone i have no energy to  help anyone  i am just confused  Past present who cares anymore really i have proven to them i am not her  i am not her. Jazzey you undestand this pain as you know the confusion somehow this has to stop and i will make it stop i will

---------- Post added at 08:40 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:22 PM ----------

Logic logic everything you say it is right it needs to be done logically to heal face it all. I understand please don't be upset okay i do understand and will try  sorry the pain takes over sometimes  I appreciate you keeping logic in all this thanks   i do understand.


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## David Baxter PhD (Dec 27, 2009)

Violet said:


> Put myself first then they will make me pay do you understand.



Nonsense. What you are really afraid of is that if you stop being a caretaker you will disappear. They won't make you pay. You fear that YOU will make you pay, because then you will have to face who you are when you're not defining yourself by other people. And what if you don't like the person you see? That's what keeps you stuck.



Violet said:


> Im sorry i am so weak and tired  and i just want the past to go away



Of course you do, but it won't. As my mother used to say, "If wishes were horses, beggars would ride". Wishing won't change anything. Change takes commitment and effort.



Violet said:


> I hate myself so much  ihate where i am



Then move forward away from that person you hate to a person you could become that you might not hate... No one keeps you stuck there except you.



Violet said:


> I was a somebody  I was important  i showed them all now i am tired   I have nothing more to prove to anybody.



Is that really what made you important, a somebody? Was it all about defining yourself in the shadow of other people? What would happen if you stepped out of that shadopw and out of that role? Who would you be then?


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## forgetmenot (Dec 27, 2009)

All very good questions to think about some i have answers to others not yet.  I know something inside me made me fight to escape a past of shame of anger of pain.  I became a nurse because i didn't want others to suffer.  I only know who i am and that is a carer that is what defines me.  Move on from the person i hate oh god i thought i did she was left behind i thought i did.  It was all about showing others these people who were professionals who were in authority who were suppose to protect and care but didn't  It was to show them all i didn't need them i would become someone even without them.  I have a hard time trusting these dam professionals these people who i cant do this i have so  much hate anger inside me.  I don't need anyone i am a survivor i am she wasnt she still isn't she cries over nothing.  I am a survivor. I will continue to look over these questions Dr Baxter continue to think about what it is you are saying to me. I am trying to understand change does not happen over night but i am trying to see more clearly thats all i can do is to keep trying   thanks for giving me something to think about.


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## David Baxter PhD (Dec 27, 2009)

Of course she's not left behind, Violet. You just said  a couple of posts ago that you hate the person you are now. Those professionals are not the real targets of your hate - the real problem here is self-hatred.


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## forgetmenot (Dec 27, 2009)

Okay yeh self hatred a big thing i do hate me so much for being so dam weak. I hate me for letting this dam pain back in for letting them hurt me all over again.  I don't know just need to heal a guess but there is much confusion and i really don't know who me is anymore.  I thought i was someone strong and i am finding out i am so weak at times and i hate being weak. I just want the pain to go away its so real yet i know its over all of it  Logic knows it is over so get on with living now right.


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## David Baxter PhD (Dec 27, 2009)

I think it goes beyond that. And you know by now it's not just going to go away. If that were possible, it would already be gone.


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## forgetmenot (Dec 27, 2009)

Thanks your right its not going to go away. It keeps coming back in pieces in fragments and instead of facing it i run and hide pretend its not there.  I hope with this therapy it will eventually work out and i know i will eventually have to face the demons and i pray god will this time be there to get me threw it. My twin was always the strong one i tried to be oh god im sorry i know i have to keep going but as stated before the shame  i hope have the strength to do this i really do as i need this to end so i can move forward.  Thanks again for your responses Jazzey and Dr Baxter   thanks for caring and listening and seeing. okay thanks.


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## forgetmenot (Dec 31, 2009)

If i stop being the carer the nurse the pain comes.
  Invisibility sometimes that was a good thing either times not so good. 
 The only way for me to stay stable is to stay the person i became to undue my past.
   I can't deal with this child inside  I can't deal with her anger her pain. I don't know why i hate her so much but i do.
  I hold no hatred towards anyone except me and the professional who did nothing.
  I can't stop being a carer do you understand if i stop i would be noone. 
 Your right i do not like the person i see at all. I can at least respect the nurse and the care giver they are useful they take others pain away.
Tonight after yet another trigger i understand i cannot live with this child inside somehow i need to get control and keep it somehow.


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## David Baxter PhD (Dec 31, 2009)

Violet:

See The Child Within: PsychLinks.ca

This is from the book I suggested for your husband. Perhaps it would also be helpful for you.


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## Jazzey (Dec 31, 2009)

Violet, I don't know if you've realized it, but you may have inadvertently answered your own question in your post.  By being the 'carer' you never have to deal with all that pain and anger that you feel.  It's, in a way, a good cushion for you to stay in this role that you've 'created' for yourself as a coping strategy for all you've been through, a role that is (in a way at least) comfortable because you don't have to go exploring yourself and feeling the pain.  

But, as you yourself have expressed - you are feeling the pain, you are not handling the situation of being a 'carer'.  So, maybe being a carer is a far too heavy price to pay for your past tragedies?  Maybe THE solution is to stop being the carer and accept the path that you need to take to get better so that you no longer have to feel the pain?  I only see one solution here Violet.  It's won't be 'comfortable', but you're worthy of the end result.


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## forgetmenot (Dec 31, 2009)

I understand i see my doctor again soon  I will get the book for me  thanks  i will get control again  If it weren't for the triggers i would stay well. as i always have.  She is not real only in my mind she is  so i can handle this  i can make this better  Thanks again


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