# I really do hate my mother ...



## Darkside (Sep 18, 2012)

That was harder to say than I thought it would be. Wanted to change "hate" to "dislike" but hate is what I feel.

To say it (or type it) brings out self-doubt. I think to myself, how could I hate my own mother? She is charming, intelligent, persuasive, everyone likes her and she gave birth to me. She has been good to me at times in my life and done things for me when I asked her to. All she has ever wanted was the best for me. How could I be so ungrateful?

But I still hate her. I am male and I think my feelings towards her have affected my relationships with women. I don't fully understand why and I continue to doubt myself and how I could hate this person that so many people admire and talk so fondly about. But the fact is that I do.

What do I do?

What if she is actually a good person and I am a bad person? I don't know how to tell.

All I know is that I have emotional problems, my brother committed suicide, my dad went insane the last 7-8 years of his life and his rage was directed at my mother, and my sister can't stand her either. She thinks she is perfect and accepts no responsibility whatsoever. She creates illusions with words and claims they are true. When faced with the truth she denies, lies and blames others.

I see her as a fraud and socialite who puts on airs to maintain her illusions. I think my anger partly stems from her efforts to coerce me to live her illusions with her because that gives them credibility that she needs to keep them up. Meanwhile, I struggle to live the truth and not live in denial about who I am.

At age 58 this is the hardest work I have ever done, but unfortunately, I have no allies. I've tried three different therapists. My health insurance does not offer a co-pay so I have to self-pay, but most of the other therapists around here will not offer a sliding scale arrangement for people like me. I understand they have to make a living and pay the rent.

I've written essays about this and it is not recent. Throughout my life, going back to childhood, I've had angry outbursts. Both of my siblings abused me (physically and I suspect sexually) my father was often cruel and enjoyed scaring me (to which I was very sensitive) and my mother did nothing. She was rarely a direct abuser but she did it by proxy. That is, she never intervened even if she witnessed the abuse. I think it was a power thing for her to control me but without ever raising her hand. In my opinion, that is serious psychological abuse. Her form of abuse was emotional - withdraw, ignore, and occasionally insult, but always with good intentions. "But I had to do that (or say that) ... I didn't have any choice." I can remember being tormented by my older brother and my sister. I was too small to stand up to them and if I did that was when the abuse really started. But I was plenty angry so I would hold the anger in until something happened and I would lash out. As I got older I learned to just hold it in and became passive - then depressed.

Now it is time to do something different. My father is dead, my brother is dead, my sister can't hurt me (and I've recently stood up to her) and my mother had dementia.

The thing about dementia is that it rips the veil off of a naturally deceitful and abusive personality. That is what has happened with my mother. There is very little of her old facade left. She can keep it up for a few minutes, but the cracks appear after a few minutes. But I still wonder sometimes. Am I seeing this clearly? Is this my own evil I am projecting onto my mother? The facts seem to tell me otherwise, but I can't help but wonder.

This was more than I started out to write.

I'm not sure I know how to get over this on my own. I've got to find someone to help me sort this out. Maybe I am crazy and that's why I've had two failed marriages and two failed occupations.


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## making_art (Sep 18, 2012)

Darkside,

How difficult it must have been for you as a child. Sometimes it takes a few therapists before finding one that is a good fit for you. I had seen a few before finding anyone I was comfortable with. If you are in Canada there is an option to see someone covered by OHIP. There are GP's who do therapy (GP Psychotherapists) and below is a link that has the GP Psychotherapist Association listed. Attending a support group at the Mood Disorders or similar organization will provide first hand experience with therapists in your area by the group members.

Guide to Finding a Doctor | Mood Disorders Association of Ontario

I don't know if you struggle with depression but depression can look different in men as compared to women with anger being a component of depression for men. Here is a link to a Mayo clinic article talking about depression in men:

Male depression: Understanding the issues - MayoClinic.com


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## W00BY (Sep 18, 2012)

I agree a good therapist is essential.

You may even want to think about whether or not the gender of the therapist will be important. I at first decided on a male therapist as I felt more at ease with men and even though my father stabbed me and broke my bones and brain washed me into thinking he was the messiah I still felt at that time more at ease in male company.

After two years of getting nowhere with the male therapist and ending the sessions, I was still suffering flash backs and terrible depression and I took a huge risk on finding a female therapist as I felt I could not relate to women due to my mother never treating me as her daughter, but I had recognized I had major sexual issues I could not talk to a man about (my fathers terrible mental health problems where btw down to drug abuse and my mothers behavior towards him) it was the best decision I have ever made.

I was apprehensive but I have managed to get under what my father left me with and spoon around in what my mother did to me. It has not been easy but I have managed to be honest and break down resistance that stayed the entire time I was with the male therapist.

Maybe sitting speaking to a female therapist will do the same for you. She may provide what your mother never has?

All I can say to you is do it this sooner rather than later pick up the pieces they scattered for you and start piecing yourself back together, in another post I made the point that it is not easy to admit that those nearest and dearest to you - those who's duty it should be to love you as you love them - don't and have instead hurt you.

You can already identify this and you sound like deep down you know yourself where you need to go on this journey to sort this.

I can't say you ever totally fix this but you can certainly with the right person to talk to smooth out a lot of the emotions, moods and thoughts and behaviors you have connected to your childhood and don't want anymore.

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Further more if it helps I hate my mum too, but now I just feel sorry for her because I have a level of self awareness she will never have!

I am happy and don't behave as she does, people who behave in these ways are not happy.

Finally she set out to destroy my self esteem and self worth and hasn't succeeded you sound like your half way to reclaiming yours whether you feel like it or not.


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## Darkside (Sep 18, 2012)

make_art said:


> Darkside,
> 
> How difficult it must have been for you as a child. Sometimes it takes a few therapists before finding one that is a good fit for you. I had seen a few before finding anyone I was comfortable with. If you are in Canada there is an option to see someone covered by OHIP. There are GP's who do therapy (GP Psychotherapists) and below is a link that has the GP Psychotherapist Association listed. Attending a support group at the Mood Disorders or similar organization will provide first hand experience with therapists in your area by the group members.
> 
> ...




Thanks for the link. No, I'm not in Canada and there are no programs available to me. I don't mind paying twice a month but I dread trying to find the right therapist. I guess I'll start asking around - I do know a few doctors. A few years ago I had health insurance that covered this and saw a therapist once a week. We made some headway, but it was a different crisis - at least on the surface.

When I re-read my post above I noticed a couple of things. Reading what I wrote it sounds like I divide things into "good" and "bad." I do recognize that all of us have good and bad in us and all the shades in between. But under stress I tend to see things in black and white. It also seems to me that part of my judgment about my mother is based on whether or not she helps me. If she does I see her as good, but if she does not I see her as bad. Now that she has dementia she cannot really provide any help - or even be supportive. Is that the source of my anger?

At least that is something to think about. I really want to accept these feelings and then get under the hood so to speak and understand them.

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W00BY said:


> I agree a good therapist is essential.
> 
> You may even want to think about whether or not the gender of the therapist will be important. I at first decided on a male therapist as I felt more at ease with men and even though my father stabbed me and broke my bones and brain washed me into thinking he was the messiah I still felt at that time more at ease in male company.
> 
> ...



Wow. The physical violence in my family never reached the point of using weapons. I did witness some physical stuff between my brother and sister, but for me the most damaging was the mental and emotional mistreatment. I have vague memories of asking someone in my family why something happened only to have them deny what I saw with my own eyes. It happened repeatedly and I came to doubt my own 5 senses and my interpretation of reality.

At the time it happens physical/sexual abuse is much worse, but the effects are obvious and people see it and the perpetrators can be punished. The victims usually get help - not always, but usually. When the abuse is psychological the wounds are hidden, can be easily denied and the victims rarely get help. Instead, they blame themselves and go into adulthood with distortions and poor coping behavior - at best. At worst, they end up with phobias, codependency or personality disorders.

Still, I can't change my childhood, my siblings or my parents. I have to do this myself.


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## making_art (Sep 18, 2012)

Wooby.....what terrible experiences for a child to have from a parent! You are very strong and resilient!

Darkside, good luck with finding a therapist. As hard as it can be, I would make this a priority!


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## Darkside (Sep 18, 2012)

I did see a female therapist about 10 years ago. She was very good - as was the man I saw 3 years ago. The two therapists I have seen over the last year don't seem right for me. One does not have a permanent office and the other is totally committed to DBT and really does not do psychotherapy. He is a good person to talk to, but whenever I bring up my childhood and family relationships he only wants to talk about mindfulness and radical acceptance. That stuff is helpful, but it isn't going to help me understand my anger.


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## Darkside (Sep 28, 2012)

Writing about this helps. I know I can't ask for therapy in a forum but my hope is just that someone might read it and understand ... and getting it off my chest helps a little.

I'm under a lot of stress right and it seems to be building. I've tried everything I know to relieve the stress and relax, but even though I "unwind" a little if something unexpected or unplanned happens I am easily thrown off balance and I tighten up. I have even noticed a kind of panic striking suddenly without a lot of provocation. By panic I don't mean a panic attack, but rather just over-reacting instead of stepping back, thinking and trying to problem solve. Today at work I made two mistakes that made me look pretty bad in front of my supervisor. I just wasn't focused and paying attention. This worries me not only because of the risk I will lose my job, but also because it is a symptom of how tightly wound I am right now. I am worried that if I continue to make mistakes I could lose my job. But this could be an exaggerated fear ... I'm not sure.

I described my feelings towards my mother in the first post. She is in an assisted living facility, and when she moved out of her house 2 months ago it became my job to handle her affairs. I have been paying her bills (her money not mine) with POA, but now I have to wind up her affairs in her house. What I found shocked me. Her house is in severe disrepair. She has over $12,000 in termite and water damage under the house and at least that much in the house itself. I tried for 2 years to get her to have it inspected and the outside repaired and she kept saying, "all it needs is to be washed."

Now I have to sell all the family possessions (furniture, silver, paintings, rugs, etc) at auction to pay for repairs and pay for her assisted living while I wait on the house to sell - if it will sell. In addition, I have work full-time (45-50 hours a week) and act as a general contractor and real estate agent to get this done and get it done quickly. If this goes badly (the money runs out and the house doesn't sell) it will be my responsibility. 

Today I took some mail to her. Every time I plan to go and see her I have to prepare myself. It grates on me like that terrible noise on a chalkboard so I'm usually pretty tense anyway. When I got there I found her in the community room and she begins to do her usual. She takes me by the arm and guides me where she wants me to go, tells me what to say, interrupts me when I am talking and only talks about herself. She never once asked me how I was doing, what I was doing, about her grandchildren or anything else. She acts like everyone else at this facility is in such bad shape but she is so much better than everyone else. She either can't or won't discuss the issues of property and money in a constructive way. I feel like I am talking to someone not totally in touch with reality. Despite her dementia she has always been this way. Anything distasteful or that she doesn't want to deal with she ignores, denies or just flat lies.

But what bothers me the most is that I act the same way I always do around her instead of being myself. Try as I might to do otherwise I still put on this phony facade; but what's worse is that from behind it the real part of me can tell I'm not being genuine. I act like I think she wants me to act instead of being myself. I walk away feeling disgusted and distracted and moody for hours afterwards.

It constantly amazes me how much the over-adapted child in me still controls how I react to situations even at age 58.


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## W00BY (Sep 29, 2012)

It sounds like you have so much on your hands you can't really begin to think about what you need right now.

Yet there is something still chattering away (in you) that won't shut up.

I think you are doing amazingly well, even though because of your childhood you won't feel like this yourself. 

Anger when falling back into old ways of behaving particularly with family members is where most of mines lies, I find if hard to maintain boundaries I can do else where in life, but what I have begun to work on is telling people a little of what is going on in me, those that deserve this information.

With yourself for instance, your supervisor, it may just vent a little pressure and help someone who is important (in you keeping your job) understand the pressure you are under and helps you by people understanding that things are not ideal and therefore your not functioning as you usually do.

This is something I am also not comfortable with and certainly a symptom of my childhood but if you don't speak up...people don't know and then when it's too late late you get the "why didn't you say something" conversation.

Is there anyway you can find a psychotherapist to talk to? It may help you in identifying some of these traps you keep finding yourself in behaviorally and help clear your mind of some of that unwanted clutter that is leading to all this anxiety.

With so much going on right now it may not be the right time but you could certainly look into it so when you do have some time and space you can go along.

I have no idea about support for the elderly outside of the UK but I do have friends in the US who have ended up as you are left to wind up an estate and that is not easy, there maybe an online support group that could offer advice or understanding, it is not an easy job and I've known of people not coping with that one task alone without everything else you are dealing with.

I hope you get some breathing space soon.


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## Darkside (Sep 29, 2012)

Thanks W00By. You are a compassionate person and I can tell you understand. All of this has come upon me so quickly I didn't really have a chance to prepare so I am "winging it." But these are issues I have needed to work on for a long time. It is just that they have been forced on me - I just have to believe I am capable of solving the issues.

Your idea of talking to my supervisor is a good one. I was thinking about it last night and wondered if I should and what I should say. They are good people and I think I would have to do something pretty bad to be fired, but they still deserve to know if all of this is impacting my job performance.

It is something to think about for sure.

I don't have a therapist right now. Time is an issue because I would have to miss work to see someone during business hours, but I can make up the time by working later. Most of the therapists I've talked to will not see me on a sliding scale. $100-125.00 an hour is something I can't afford right now. But I have to ask myself if I can afford not to.

Wish I knew of an easier way to find a good therapist rather than hit and miss.

Thanks again for your reply.

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You know, the abuse I suffered as a child wasn't all that bad - relatively speaking. I've read about people being burned, tortured, locked in rooms, denied food, beaten until they bled and exploited. My childhood was not that way. Yes, I was physically abused (and maybe sexually too) but the worst part was the psychological abuse. Mainly that came in the form of a family dynamic of denial. Everyone in my family lived in illusions and used denial, projection or just flat lying to maintain the illusion. As the youngest child I could not question what I saw and if I did nobody supported me and it likely led to abuse. Asking questions of adults (parents) was not allowed and if I did a reasonable explanation by an "adult" was not likely.

Even now, as an adult, I believe asking questions is "rude" and I should just accept and not question anything. Sometimes, if I am tempted to ask a question, it comes out as arguing and sometimes I "zone out" for the answer as if I expect to be yelled out or even slapped. I've read that is a form of dissociation and I've noticed that in those situations that my child's mind tell me will lead to physical or psychological abuse, my mind becomes muddled and my thinking confused. It is like suddenly my range of perception is narrowed to a small range and I freeze. In those situations I should ask questions but I am so locked up I cannot. I feel like I am a "little soldier" standing at attention. That feeling is definitely from childhood because I have this image of myself as a child standing at attention while being yelled at or hit. I was not allowed to raise my hands or run to defend myself. So I dissociated and as an adult I still do that.

I don't know if this makes sense to anyone reading it but it does to me. Sometimes it feels like I have to "wake up" as if in a bad dream and see things as they really are - through the eyes of a fully functional adult and not the limited understanding of an abused 6-8 year old.

What I wonder is why mild abuse can inflict so much injury on someone like me, and other children recover and learn to thrive even after horrific abuse?

You know what grieves me the most? The fact that I think this has been handed down in my family for generations. My father was most likely abused by his dad, and his dad was abused by his father. One of my grandfather's siblings was a writer and I've read her descriptions of her childhood so I know she witnessed abuse and was probably herself abused. 

I've even done it to my own children - especially the oldest. When he was 11 I took him in his room to spank him and he refused. He defied me and told me he would not allow me to spank him. At that moment I realized what I was doing was wrong. There were alternative ways to punish other than whipping a child with a belt. Thank God he had the awareness to stop me, but I still feel like I've passed on the abuse "gene."

God have mercy on us all.


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## MHealthJo (Sep 29, 2012)

I just wanted to express my sadness for the experiences of both of you... and commend you on your bravery, survival and facing up to these things.

WOOBY... your achievements are something to be extremely proud of and thank you for the hope it can give to people. Darkside... please never underestimate the positive significance of even starting down the journey of awareness and personal growth, and what  it can mean for those you care about to see the interest in doing this. Even if your journey has been tough to really get underway, your "hindsight-adjusted attitude" or willingness to be truthful and sorry about something is wonderful, and has more healing power than you might realise (since you express concern about damage you think you passed on.) Just this attitude, if expressed to the person, can be a huge factor in healing any wounds and circumventing  any "passing on" of these things. 

At least, this has been very true for me. I am obscenely fortunate in having received these healing factors from the source of my damage, quite early in my adulthood. Really I was sort of the catalyst for it and i did some informed fighting for it, BUT I had the pure luck that the nature of the person's mental problem even allowed this possibility... allowed any breaking down of the defense mechanisms which were previously holding their "mental situation" where it was.

Please at least notice that your children seem to have this advantage too, by the sound of where you are at, and just that in itself is a very positive thing.


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## W00BY (Sep 30, 2012)

I understand totally Darkside,

I get most of my dissociative sensation (which is like a drunken dream-like sensation) when I am directly tapped into memories from childhood and by that I don't just mean flashbacks etc I mean the sensations I felt as a child, helpless loneliness, the sensation of being powerless to stop what is happening, anger, distrust.

The things you are struggling with are without a doubt the hardest things to get over which gives some insight to me that you have probably worked very hard already to change things both with how you feel and react.

You are able to understand your family dynamics in a very objective way which helps you to avoid making the same mistakes but it comes at a great emotional physical exhaustion because every time you use these resources you are tapping into places your brain really doesn't want to be going and that is why psychotherapy is helpful here.

It gives a structured environment in which to explore this stuff, your brain can only put so much away before the thoughts you don't want start spilling back out bringing all the emotions and feelings that come with this "leakage". This is exactly the sensation that made me go to psychotherapy I knew I had reached the end of the road and that whether I liked it or not I had to think about this stuff and try and order it all so I could move on.

A lot of what you are stressing about and beating yourself up over is not actually "your" thought processes, it is ways of thinking that have been inflicted because of childhood experiences and that is incredibly difficult to break so we spin round in the react, remember, hate, get angry and try and forget again cycle

It is very telling that you can see clearly the dysfunction generationally within your family, this is much the same as mines and what I can see, yet no one else seems to be able to within my family and much the same as yourself again, anything awkward gets swept under the rug, which included myself.

I have read quite a bit on how people can react to abusive childhoods and they fall basically into two categories, they go on to do the same or worse or the they strive to break the cycle and not repeat what they experienced.

Unfortunately too many go on to do the same or worse than they experienced, but this is where I draw comfort and you should to, in that you are aware enough that you can see those patterns and strive to avoid them carving out both a different path for yourself and those around you.

It is not easy to do though, and I suspect this may be where much of your anxiety lies, you have to be tapped into the past to be able for it not to shape behavior now and that is exhaustive, your are working twice as much mentally to keep things under control than the average person.

It could be if you start speaking about your issues to people who can help i.e in your work etc that they may be able to recommend a psychotherapist or know of someone who has accessed a service where it does not cost as much as what the others you have checked out.

Only you will know what you can and cannot speak to these people about but what I do know is your of no use to anyone if your becoming so swamped you can't function. 

From reading your posts I see a resilience and awareness that most people don't exercise if you utilized this a bit more in your own favor anything is truly possible. 

You are at a very difficult juncture in life where the dynamic between yourself and your mother has shifted dramatically and you have been left with the underside of all of this to sort out, I feel you (under the circumstances) are doing very well and how you are feeling is easily understandable given all you are facing.


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## MHealthJo (Sep 30, 2012)

Exactly... so much amazing, incredible work must already have been done, for you to be where you're at, Darkside. I am so happy WOOBY has so much relevant experience that is a great resource... gosh, it must be so crucial to find someone with similar enough experiences to truly understand, and it could be quite difficult to find that, i imagine.

That does make me wonder about the option of support groups or some sort of group work? I have no idea whether you have already considered options like that, or whether they would be suitable or applicable for these situations as an interim option perhaps, until you find a good fit for an affordable therapist?

Yes, I hope you have some good luck soon in finding what you need. Your needs for balance and good mental health and self-care are important, and not secondary to other stuff or another person. I hope that will keep sinking in and you'll experience more and more benefits from that process.


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## Darkside (Sep 30, 2012)

Thank you both for your insights. Both of you wrote some things that are so very true.

I have done some of the heavy lifting, but it is only now that I feel like I actually understand what happened to me as a child and how it has affected me as an adult. There is a saying in Christian teaching (and probably in other religions) that God never allows us to be tested beyond what we can handle. I suppose that time is now.

Yesterday I emailed one of my supervisors and got a response saying she understood and not to worry, but also to speak to the project manager tomorrow. She is a good person and she will understand. At least I don't feel like I am about to lose my job. 

W00BY, you are so right about the amount of energy it takes to keep myself together. One thing I noticed recently is that under stress my throat feels like it is closing - it feels like its hard to breath.

I wish it wasn't so hard to find a good therapist.


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## Darkside (Oct 9, 2012)

My mother has found my phone number and has been calling me 2-3 times a week. She is in assisted living, but she wants this and that. It really grates on my nerves and she is either unaware or does not care what a burden all of this has become. Sunday I called her and told her I would take her to her house to pick up some of her clothes. I knew it would be an ordeal so I spent over an hour preparing myself mentally. I told her up front we had to finish before dark. Well, she goes in and starts looking around at all her stuff. Then she starts telling me the things she wants. A few things is fine but I reminded her about the clothes. She ignored me and kept on putting things in a box. "Mom, it is getting dark and I can't see to put these things in the car." Finally she starts getting her clothes - which I have to carry. Thankfully, she finished quickly but then started going through drawers and looking in boxes. See, it's all about her and she never once asked about how the house repairs were going and how I was doing ... NOT ONE SINGLE TIME. Still, I stayed pretty calm and let her look around until it started to get very dark and then I had to push her to hurry up.

Today she calls me up again, and although she sugarcoats it with politeness, she starts telling me the things she wants. "I need a blanket for my bed", "I need money" "I need to go the beauty parlor" -- "oh, and thank you so much for all you've done." 

My immediate response is to think, "well, if I leave work now and do all these things I can be back in an hour or maybe an hour and a half." Then I realized, I don't have to do any of it right that second. Yeah, I'll get the old bitch a blanket, but she will have to figure out how to get to the beauty parlor and how to pay for it. I'm not her chauffeur or at her beck and call. Yeah right ... I don't have a life of my own I just exist to do for her and listen to her go on and on about her "things" and her life without any awareness of anyone else. I've never met anyone so selfish and so self-centered. 

I'm a horrible son.


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## forgetmenot (Oct 9, 2012)

No hun you are not a horrible son  you have to set boundaries and keep them right  Don't let your mother manipulate you any longer hun.   You have your life now and when you can fit time in you do it.    Your mother will never change  it is you that have to change and you are slowly doing that.  She will learn your boundaries and will have to abide by them  if she wants you in her life   hugs toyou


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## Darkside (Oct 11, 2012)

Thanks forgetmenot. 

So I went over there with a blanket and some money for the beauty parlor. Now she wants a quilt, another chair and she isn't going to the beauty parlor because she doesn't have a way to get there. I didn't volunteer to take her thank God. I can't tell what she really remembers and what she makes up out of thin air.

For once in my life I wish I would stand up to her and tell her "no" to her face or how selfish and self-centered she acts. It would be a big step for me.

I don't seem to be able to stand up for myself unless I get really, really angry and then whatever I say or do turns out to be an overreaction.


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## Darkside (May 11, 2014)

I just realized something important. At least part of the reason I am angry with my mother is that she did not protect me from sibling abuse when I was a child. She could have, and she knew about it, but she didn't lift one finger and never punished my older brother and sister for what they did.

Mainly she was just too busy being a socialite, but she also chose to look the other way. I mentioned this to her one time and her response was, "well, if I had known I would have done something."

Her powers of denial are something to behold.


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## Darkside (May 12, 2014)

That's not to say she wasn't an abuser too. She just used a scalpel and the others used a sledgehammer.


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## GDPR (May 12, 2014)

I bet our mothers would be best friends if they met each other,they sound like they have a lot in common.


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## Darkside (May 12, 2014)

Even at 94, and with dementia, her denial skills are still strong and she is clever about it. If she doesn't want to admit something she will find a way not to. She takes responsibility for nothing.

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Lost_In_Thought said:


> I bet our mothers would be best friends if they met each other,they sound like they have a lot in common.



Honest and responsible people do not like my mother. She can fool some of them for a short time, but I remember that the parents of friends of mine growing up avoided her. Most didn't care for her arrogance and haughtiness. She was able to maintain that facade even after my brother committed suicide.


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