# Donald Trump



## GDPR

I sometimes feel like watching,or listening to,Donald Trump is just as horrifying as all the violence happening in the world.It's like we are being punked or something,is this even real?He leaves me scratching my head and thinking wtf....


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## MHealthJo

*Re: What Are You Feeling Today?*

This is true LIT.    It's like, how did this actually happen???

You are one of the people who lives in the right country to do something about it... every vote will be needed for the major candidate who can defeat him.  
Wish I knew how I could mobilize lots of mistreated devalued women in pretty rightwing areas to pretend they're voting that way to feel safe, but to secretly in the ballot room not only defeat  the problem but let in the first female POTUS....


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## GDPR

*Re: What Are You Feeling Today?*



MHealthJo said:


> You are one of the people who lives in the right country to do something about it... every vote will be needed for the major candidate who can defeat him



That's right,all of you here in the U.S. need to get out there and vote this year!Don't just sit and complain,DO something about it!


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## Harebells

*Re: What Are You Feeling Today?*

Yup Lit, your fellow humans around the globe share your confusion and sense of mounting horror.
We were laughing when he started his campaign, but now....not so much

Thank goodness for people like you who have a vote...hope you succeed!


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## desiderata

*Re: What Are You Feeling Today?*

He's as real as Wisconsin cheese but without the whole ingredients, patience, and care that make a good cheese. The only thing comparable are all the holes in the two.


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## Harebells

*Re: What Are You Feeling Today?*

I would rather the cheese be the US president, if it came down to it.


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## amazingmouse

*Re: What Are You Feeling Today?*

There is so much hate and misconceptions in this electoral campaign, people are fighting with each other, disrespectful to other's opinions, views or presented evidence. It feels almost like the US is at the verge of civil war.
I do not vote in the US elections, but I believe the results will impact the world. By the way, here is an interesting book, that those voting must read with an open mind in order to make an informed decision:

Clinton Cash: The Untold Story of How and Why Foreign Governments and Businesses Helped Make Bill and Hillary Rich: Peter Schweizer: 9780062369284: Books - Amazon.ca


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## GDPR

*Re: What Are You Feeling Today?*



amazingmouse said:


> There is so much hate and misconceptions in this electoral campaign, people are fighting with each other, disrespectful to other's opinions, views or presented evidence.



That is true,but also the nature of the beast.

Many people in my town plan on voting for Hillary just because they feel she is the 'lesser of two evils',while others don't plan on voting at all because they simply don't know what's true and what's not.And I'm not exactly sure why many of them are supporting Trump,but I have noticed the ones that do have become more  aggressive,increasingly racist and disdainful towards others and I do worry about that.(* I am only speaking about my own town,not the rest of the population*).


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## amazingmouse

*Re: What Are You Feeling Today?*

If Americans realize that the information in the above book is factual and still vote for Hillary,  then this means that Americans are comfortable with choosing a president, who is known to be corrupt worldwide, and to lie to them relentlessly. Not to mention, the threats she created to your National security and the arrogance with which she lies about them and places herself above the law. Frankly,  she was under criminal investigation by the FBI until last month. I would be very uncomfortable voting for such a person. To be honest,  she is an embarrassment to your country. 
If she is  sincere about supporting gays and women and all religious minorities, then she should not be accepting tens of millions of dollars from Saudi Arabia and similar countries.
Maybe people support Trump,  because he has a clean history,  nothing he had ever done comes even close to national security threats and FBI investigations.
In terms of violence,  there was a lot of violence against Trump supporters at his rallies,  where it was determined by police that other candidates fans went to his rallies and attacked peaceful supporters,  including women and teens. This was actually documented and shown on TV. The women and the teen were not engaging with the  attackers at all. It sounds like you believe that this guy (Trump)  is a criminal or a monster, when in fact he is a successful businessman, without history of compromising US national security. I guess he makes the current political elite uncomfortable. 
If you think that the US security is not a priority, wait for the open borders policy of Hillary. I am not an expert on it, but the experts in the US have spoken, and I suggest people read what they have to say. 
Hillary will be the Merkel of the US.  In Sweden or Germany, the statistics are that 1 of 4 women will be raped by migrants. I stopped traveling to Europe due to the events there and the no-go zones in the big cities. I love the US,  have lived there and would hate it if the US become an impossible tourist destination.


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## GDPR

*Re: What Are You Feeling Today?*

I respect your right to your own personal opinions and choose to not have a debate over it.Nobody will change my mind,and my own personal thoughts and opinions on this anyway.I am just grateful I do have the opportunity to vote in a way I feel is best.


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## amazingmouse

*Re: What Are You Feeling Today?*

I understand. This is not a political site, and debating is very different than simply insulting other candidates. 
The reason, I did post here is because I wanted to clarify that some of us think differently.  It seems there was an assumption that everyone on the site agrees with the insults towards Donald Trump and an aggressive attempt to intimidate his supporters, even though this site is not supposed to be about politics. Fact is, there is millions of people in the US and all over the world who support Donald Trump and think (differently).
Anyway I am out of the "What do you feel" thread and will not be responding to posts  hope everyone on here feels well for the rest of the time.


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## GDPR

I see this has been moved and it's an entire thread dedicated to Donald Trump.Okay,this could be fun....



---------- Post Merged at 03:34 PM ---------- Previous Post was at 03:17 PM ----------


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## Harebells

Sooo......maybe we should start discussing religion now??


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## GDPR




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## David Baxter PhD

I don't personally have an interest in discussing either politics or religion. I have my own opinions and beliefs but I don't enjoy debating them with others.

However, as long as discussions are kept civil, polite, respectful, and non-defamatory, you can discuss whatever you like in the Just Chat forum. 

Keep in mind that I don't want people fighting or getting hurt feelings, and I don't want to get sued for libel or slander or anything of that ilk.


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## GDPR

I took Harebells statement about religion as being funny(I think that's how it was meant).

I don't like debating politics or religion with others either,and this wasn't meant to be a debate or turn into one,it was more just personal thoughts of my own,as were posts others made.None of us went into details about what we feel Trump is doing wrong,or even why he shouldn't be supported or anything,more just personal statements.It was all pretty civil.

I do like that this has been put into its own thread,now people can choose to read and/or respond just by reading the title,although I doubt anyone will reply anymore since it turned into something it was not meant to be,which seems to be a pattern lately.


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## Harebells

Yes I was just trying to defuse the situation with humour...(as in politics and religion being the things you should never discuss)....that worked out well, obviously. Maybe I won't go into a career in mediation after all. Sorry really didn't intend to hurt anyone's feelings.


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## David Baxter PhD

I'm not saying anyone's feelings have been hurt. Just stating that you can discuss what you wish.


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## Harebells

Well ok then...


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## GDPR




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## Harebells

He really is the meme-gift that keeps on giving isn't he?


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## GDPR

I am really excited,yet at the same time,dreading the upcoming presidential debates.It's going to be like watching a trainwreck,I won't want to watch yet I won't be able to look away.

Anyone going to watch?


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## rdw

No I am not going to watch . I'm afraid to watch actually mg:mg:


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## MHealthJo

Same as RDW... Am curious, but don't think I can handle it.


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## making_art

I just cant do it...


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## amazingmouse

I have more important things to do than watching a debate involving corrupt elitists.


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## GDPR

I watched it,and it gave me anxiety knowing one of them is going to be the next president.


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## amazingmouse

As far as I am concerned, women in North America in general are not treated equally economically, socially, physically or in any other aspects more often than not. Tell me one thing: What has Hillary every done for women? Anything specific, other than herself running for POTUS as a role model, anything that she has done for US women? I can't think of anything, honestly. Planned parenthood, the Saudis buying influence and policy changes through her so called foundation, the intimidation and sexual harassment of women that her husband was involved with, creating "0" opportunities for low income women. She keeps talking about her childcare plans. Where were they in the last few decades? When I was in the US, childcare was so expensive that most immigrant and low income women had zero chance of entering the workforce. Bill was a disgrace as a man, who demonstrated that sexual harassment, abuse of women's rights is just fine, it is justified even at the highest levels of government administration, so it must be okay to do this just anywhere else. Hillary supported him. Honestly, these people have no integrity at all.
Trump has said some rude and inappropriate things about some women as well. But, his actions are not as bad as his words. He has not done anything that directly violates women's rights. In his male dominated business he has appointed more women executives than most other business owners. He has given corporate career opportunities to numerous women. In the TV business, the Latina beauty pageant that they were talking about on the debate had a contract to maintain her looks for at least one year after becoming "Miss Universe". She made somewhere around 4-5 million dollars from winning the title. That was her professional career and she was well aware of the nature of this business. She did not abide by the job contract. If someone gave me that much money to stay fit for one year, you bet I would do it! If I can't, fair enough, I was not meant to be a beauty queen, lol. 
Trump advocated for her to not have her "Miss Universe" title revoked, as she was in fact capable to get back in shape. She had a choice to work a regular job like most women instead of becoming "Miss Universe", and even after the competition, she could have decided that she did not want the title. It was her own decision/will to enter the modelling business, where women are judged by their looks. I do not see anything shocking in her story. 
I also think Trump's child care policies will be better for US women. Ivanka spoke of her role in advising him how to help mothers. I do not think Hillary will do anything different than what she had done so far in childcare, and what she had done so far in this area is bad and it keeps women out of the workforce.


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## GDPR




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## amazingmouse

I know, it is impossible to say even a word in defence of Hillary... sorry for asking. I thought her supporters could answer the question about what exactly had she done for women in her decades long political career...I was hoping I missed something, but no luck


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## GDPR

Nah,it's not 'impossible',there's just really no point in it.You already summed them both up pretty accurately by saying 





> corrupt elitists


.

Much has changed since this thread started and I,just like nearly everyone else I know,will be voting for the 'lesser of two evils'.It's pathetic that it has come to this.


I just know I definitely don't want Trump as president.


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## MHealthJo

Despite the misinformation,  obfuscation and lying campaigns, Hillary has actually done a lot of important work for promoting the rights, freedoms, equality, choices and wellbeing of women, children, and the disadvantaged. 

Education and better advantages for children and families become advantages for the women that girls grow into.

Hillary Clinton’s Long, Committed Record Advocating For Women and Children

She Wins We Win


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## amazingmouse

Clinton is more corrupt, but anyway. I guess there is no point discussing her,  if people can't cite any legitimate reason to support her. The only arguments "for" her are insults of Trump and some lies about what he had said. But what did she say and what did she do in her political career so far... lies, bribes, investigations by the FBI,  I just don't understand who would vote for more of that. It is an interesting cultural phenomenon to approve of such political behavior.


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## GDPR

Exactly why I consider her the lesser of two evils.At least I CAN find some good things about her.

Thanks MHJ


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## MHealthJo

Donald Trump Gets Caught Tweet-Handed - The Atlantic


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## amazingmouse

That's nothing comparing to her scandals and lies,  including lies to the families of killed American heroes. She had lied numerous times and will continue to do so if elected. I guess people don't care anymore how they get treated by the political elite?

---------- Post Merged at 07:27 PM ---------- Previous Post was at 07:21 PM ----------

I guess that's the answer to way would anyone vote for a Liar. Anyway, I am out of here. Have fun.


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## GDPR




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## MHealthJo

MHealthJo said:


> Despite the misinformation,  obfuscation and lying campaigns, Hillary has actually done a lot of important work for promoting the rights, freedoms, equality, choices and wellbeing of women, children, and the disadvantaged.
> 
> Education and better advantages for children and families become advantages for the women that girls grow into.
> 
> Hillary Clinton’s Long, Committed Record Advocating For Women and Children
> 
> She Wins We Win


Oh, my first phrase is referring to the opposing campaign, just for clarity. Haha that coulda sounded confusing. 🙃


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## GDPR

Nobody 'jokes' about dating their own daughter except those that actually would.'nuff said!

You know,you could always start your own thread, in support of Trump,so you don't feel the need to keep defending him in this one,if you like.You already know what's in this thread,you know you won't be changing any minds or swaying votes,so it might be a good route to go if it bothers or offends you.


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## David Baxter PhD

Two posts containing specific as yet unproven allegations against the candidates have been removed for reasons of potential liabilities.

Please confine any comments to those that are not potentially libelous.


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## GDPR

Sorry Dr.Baxter.I understand why you removed our posts, I just didn't think about it at the time I posted mine.


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## amazingmouse

Thanks, you are right. I guess there was just nothing else that I found interesting to comment on, but yes, LIT is right too, there is no point on posting such discussions. Plus I do not believe any of these candidates are flawless, nor do I really care. Sorry if my post offended anybody.


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## GDPR

Just thought this face swap was funny,and a bit creepy.


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## David Baxter PhD

I don't know why this thread was closed. For those who were interested in it, it is now reopened.

Just please be respectful of other people's opinions and don't post anything that will get us sued.


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## GDPR

I asked for it to be closed.When I watched the last debate I was so triggered I became physically ill and had so much anxiety my entire body started shaking.I just wanted to make sure I didn't come here and post while in that state and cause any problems.

Sorry.

I simply can't even talk about Trump anymore for my own mental health.I am sure that with everything going on it's not even necessary for me to explain why.But I suppose I can just  avoid this thread,it probably wasn't right,or fair of me to ask for it to be closed.


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## Harebells

Hi Lit - sorry it was me hassling Steve and David as to why it had been closed - now I read your reasons I regret it and I understand. I'm happy for it to be closed if everyone else is. And sorry for causing it to get bumped!!


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## David Baxter PhD

We rarely close threads here permanently although sometimes we do it as a temporary measure to let people cool off. 

Ultimately, we've found it's pretty difficult to predict what might trigger someone, almost impossible sometimes. I think we have to assume that most people know their own triggers and will take the necessary steps to avoid them or otherwise manage them.


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## GDPR

No apology is needed Harebells,but thank you.

Feel free to leave it open and post whatever you like,nobody else is responsible for my PTSD,my triggers and how I react to them,only I am.

This is just one of those times where I have to say okay,that's enough,and back away,but it doesn't mean everyone else has to also.

---------- Post Merged at 01:40 PM ---------- Previous Post was at 01:38 PM ----------

Oh,I see Dr.Baxter posted while I was typing and pretty much said the same as I did about triggers.


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## David Baxter PhD

There are some threads I don't read at all because the topics don't interest me. I have little interest in most debates about politics or religion, for example. I just don't follow those threads. If I post in them, I generally unsubscribe soon after.


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## amazingmouse

In any dictatorship regimen one is not allowed to express an opinion different from the mainstream.
If you support anything in a direction different from the left,  you are labeled as racist, bigot,  rapist, and all other kinds of -ists. This is what is happening on the media and social media now. I am used to it,  as I have lived in communist country when young, so nothing new to me.

---------- Post Merged at 01:46 PM ---------- Previous Post was at 01:44 PM ----------

By the way,  I was triggered by Hanity's interview of the woman,  who was raped at 12 and her rapist was represented by Hillary.  I found this the hallmark of the worst in this campaign.


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## David Baxter PhD

amazingmouse said:


> By the way,  I was triggered by Hanity's interview of the woman,  who was raped at 12 and her rapist was represented by Hillary.  I found this the hallmark of the worst in this campaign.



The facts are Clinton didn't want the case but was appointed against her wishes by the court to defend the man. Contrary to reports by her detractors, she did not "get the man off" or "laugh at the victim". She simply did her job as a public defender and moved on.


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## Harebells

But to me it seems that having people disagree with your opinion is not the same as not being allowed to have it.


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## David Baxter PhD

Harebells said:


> But to me it seems that having people disagree with your opinion is not the same as not being allowed to have it.



Exactly.


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## Harebells

Sorry I was replying to amazingmouse's post there -I hadn't seen David's.

---------- Post Merged at 06:54 PM ---------- Previous Post was at 06:53 PM ----------

...Or his last one!!


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## amazingmouse

Good luck.


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## desiderata

My biggest concern is not Donald Trump winning the election but setting a trend for future elections.


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## Out West

I take it you have not heard the audio of her laughing about the case. Which prompted the victim to come forth and speak so many years after the crime.


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## GDPR

I will be SO glad when the election is over and done with.Not long to go!


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## making_art

Me too!


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## GDPR

Omg,I will be so glad for it to be over with tomorrow finally.This has been the dirtiest,most scandalous ever in history I think.


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## making_art

LIT said:


> Omg,I will be so glad for it to be over with tomorrow finally.This has been the dirtiest,most scandalous ever in history I think.



Yeah....your poor country! I have not been watching any if it lately but our CBC radio did an article about how there is an entire city of people who want to move to Canada if Trump wins...and there are ads encouraging your folks to come to certain regions if our Country.


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## GDPR

I am not even voting at all this time.And I plan on staying home all day just because I think it's better to be safe than sorry.

Never in my life would I have imagined there would come a time I would actually be afraid to vote,that I would be afraid of my own safety by doing so.


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## amazingmouse

making_art said:


> Yeah....your poor country! I have not been watching any if it lately but our CBC radio did an article about how there is an entire city of people who want to move to Canada if Trump wins...and there are ads encouraging your folks to come to certain regions if our Country.


It would be nice to get celebrities move to Northern Ontario, Saskatchewan etc, lol, Canada would become a nation of celebrities. I just hope Justin Bieber remains in the US!


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## GDPR

I don't even know what to say.All I keep thinking is this man,the one that said grab them by the p*ssy,is our president.

I am speechless.


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## MHealthJo

Occasionally I wonder exactly how 'conspiracy theory' to get... whether a president is someone who makes any of the real decisions in a place of that level of power or not, or whether each top candidate is kind of 'chosen' by parties that we don't see operating or whatever, for purposes other than making any real decisions. I do wonder sometimes.

Well, Australia is a fairly OK place, I guess, nobody likes any of the politicians here ever or takes them the slightest bit seriously, we just laugh about them, and the Asians invest in all the property here because our parties are so similar and not much ever really changes that much - predictability and stability is good for investment or something. Very strong antigun laws and extremely low gun ownership too, and the police overall seem pretty good. Come on down everybody.

*Oh, huge disclaimer about outrageous cost of living though. *


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## desiderata

It comes down to credibility. If and when anyone proves this they can become trustworthy. If not abused, momentum upwards can be achieved.
We The People are what our forefathers recognized to be true and it is up to each of us to make a difference for our's and our children's future.
I've always said that life isn't fair but it's up to all us to make it as fair as possible.


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## GDPR

I suppose the only thing to do is to move forward now and hope Trump does a good job and makes positive changes.

There's always hope.


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## MHealthJo

Yup. Who knows what could happen... I don't know how the institutions and rules etc work over there, but when there is a wildcard situation like this, I don't know whether sometimes somebody could end up not even staying president as long as expected, or who knows what. And sometimes  unexpected things can later lead to positive reforms in systems or some sort of positive changes over time. I heard a few things that gave me food for thought today, reading about all kinds of different angles on the whole thing.

But hugs to those out there needing them. Especially depending what kinds of different concerns and worries and feelings are attached to all of this, for different individuals in different situations facing this. Lotttsss of people across the whole world have struggled watching and trying to make sense of all of this.


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## amazingmouse

Harebells said:


> But to me it seems that having people disagree with your opinion is not the same as not being allowed to have it.


But it seems to me that they didn't?


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## GDPR

MHealthJo said:


> Occasionally I wonder exactly how 'conspiracy theory' to get... whether a president is someone who makes any of the real decisions in a place of that level of power or not, or whether each top candidate is kind of 'chosen' by parties that we don't see operating or whatever, for purposes other than making any real decisions. I do wonder sometimes.



There's so many different theories out there,some really seem plausible.Even Trump himself kept saying it was rigged,and I believe that,especially now.

There's alot of protesting going on,so much tension and discontent,I don't know where it's going to lead but maybe it's all part of an elaborate plan that I have been reading about for quite a few years.


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## MHealthJo

You have to admit when you see a thing that to so many seemed impossible and absurd, you just don't know what to think, and the more and more conspiracy theory style  things start to seem plausible! Well considering dirty or dishonest or trying-to-be-hidden things being known about so much already with more evidence that we get coming out about certain things these days. On the other hand politics and groups of people and demographics are so complicated, and after the fact you start reading about all kinds of factors in those things which many sources realise they had overlooked or underestimated. Also, I read about this professor who has accurately predicted every US election for years and years simply on the basis of this bunch of yes or no questions relating to what is happening in the country at the time. And he predicted Trump.

Well, I'm actually starting to somehow feel a tiny bit better. Some circles that I read had pretty much decided this is going to be some sort of fascism or what have you. But now I keep thinking, well heck, maybe some things were said but not meant, simply for the purpose of bravado and bluster as well as getting certain voter groups on board just during the time when you NEED them and their votes....?? Only to disappoint or not follow through. I honestly have no idea though, and I really have not followed all this or the people involved for a very long time at all.

At the moment until I see what happens, I guess I'm taking a weird comfort/hope in the idea that politicians after their promises and speeches, so often can be relied on to disappoint or not follow through??! Usually that's thought of as a bad thing, but sometimes not?!?


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## GDPR

Things are starting to become very heated.I am surprised at the amount of arguing happening in my town on social media.People are starting to threaten each other,there's name calling,insults,etc.I have been avoiding Facebook because my newsfeed is nothing but hate.

And the protests are becoming violent,as I am sure some of you have seen or heard about already.

I think it will only get worse.


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## making_art

LIT said:


> Things are starting to become very heated.I am surprised at the amount of arguing happening in my town on social media.People are starting to threaten each other,there's name calling,insults,etc.I have been avoiding Facebook because my newsfeed is nothing but hate.
> 
> And the protests are becoming violent,as I am sure some of you have seen or heard about already.
> 
> I think it will only get worse.



I stopped watching the news even before the election.... Its just too much stress and not worth the energy required. Try to find some activity that brings you comfort and let it go...

Today is Remembrance Day in Canada. War, the result of bad national relations and politics.


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## MHealthJo

I've seen a few things about people who are supposedly considered likely to get important positions in the new government - although I haven't gone deep and checked it all out yet and don't want to worry too much if it has not yet happened or may not actually happen. But I can't say I'm not worried. Reports which seem to suggest that it has emboldened and increased certain behaviours and problems, also worry me.  

Even if I could hope that a president may be just a puppet, it's still not good if an outcome of an election emboldens certain bad stuff.


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## amazingmouse

Left extremists protesting Constitutional Democracy on the US streets.

 The same left who declared before the elections that they will accept the results, only because they thought Hilliary was winning. Some of the protesters were announced to be "professional protesters", much like the ones Clinton paid to protest and shut down Trump rallies in major US cities before the elections.


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## GDPR

Comparing them to Nazis is a little extreme don't you think?


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## rdw

Donald Trump is a polarizing figure with his alt right views. , I'm sure the protests against him will continue throughout his term of office.


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## GDPR

I read somewhere that America just wasn't ready for a female president,that if Hillary was male she would have definitely won.It makes me wonder how much truth there is to that statement.I can't help but wonder how much influence Trump had on that with the way he speaks of females.


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## MHealthJo

I don't consider myself to know politics deeply but many sources feel she was actually a rather weak candidate in many ways/not the right candidate for this particular time and should not have been chosen under the circumstances, as well as factors of how the campaign was run have been considered not done so well. I don't know and I also don't really know how easy or difficult it is for a party, campaign, candidate to really really really know its electorate. What I do know is the misogyny and sexism that exists, existed before Trump. That, I want to see change more and more... so I guess what I'm really interested in now is what exactly can move that forward faster. I have thoughts but it's a topic I want to learn about further and more deeply, and I guess that gives me ideas of something constructive/positive/satisfying/hopeful that I can do.


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## GDPR

MHealthJo said:


> What I do know is the misogyny and sexism that exists, existed before Trump.



Yes,that is true,it existed before Trump.I guess my wondering was from what I have seen in my own town through all of this.I am sure the ones that are disrespectful towards women always were,but maybe they felt it was more acceptable to voice their opinions and disrespect more openly due to all the media about Trump(again,speaking about my own town only).And maybe were influenced in that way.


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## MHealthJo

I have read similar reports to what you have seen, LIT - so yeah, like not 'creating from scratch' these attitudes and things that exist, but more like an emboldening effect in these last couple of days in terms of the level of overt behaviour. Really worrying. I don't know if it is affecting all areas of your country but certainly it seems to be a phenomenon happening in some areas. I truly hope it is temporary and short.


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## rdw

People can always agree to disagree politely without using inflammatory language


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## GDPR

MHealthJo said:


> I have read similar reports to what you have seen, LIT - so yeah, like not 'creating from scratch' these attitudes and things that exist, but more like an emboldening effect in these last couple of days in terms of the level of overt behaviour. Really worrying. I don't know if it is affecting all areas of your country but certainly it seems to be a phenomenon happening in some areas. I truly hope it is temporary and short.




The saddest thing I have seen firsthand is young children,as young as 3 and 4 ,imitating what they have seen and heard.I have seen little girls upset over being called 'Miss Piggy' by little boys.Have heard them argue over which they like better,Trump or Hillary,it's spilling over into the very young ones,and it's sad to me.


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## David Baxter PhD

As much as I hate to do this, it seems that this thread keeps getting out of hand and people keep getting upset about it.

I think after close to 100 posts, if we count the ones removed, all that needs to be said about Trump has been said.

This thread is closed. Let's all move on to something else please.


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