# Saving someones life?



## Superiority Tails (Oct 7, 2006)

Can a promise keep someone from commenting suicide?


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## David Baxter PhD (Oct 7, 2006)

Depends on the promise. And on the person.


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## Superiority Tails (Oct 8, 2006)

If I promised a friend not to kill himself. There's a chance that he will and a chance he won't. How long could that last if he follows through with his promises.


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## Misha (Oct 8, 2006)

In my experience a promise not to commit suicide means very little.  But a promise that I will "see you in the morning," or even more significant, that I will DO SOMETHING FOR YOU in the morning, is more of a force worth reckoning with.  
It is the relationship behind the promise and probably not the promise itself that means something.  
For example, I have had many residences in my life and signed leases/contracts.  Never before have I been "kept alive" by not wanting to disappoint my landlord.  But the landlord I have right now has invested in me emotionally, knows my story (basics) and is giving me a second chance at life.  There is relationship, so my promise that I have to pay her rent at the begininning of every month for the next 6 months means something.  Granted when I am extremely suicidal that alone will not keep me alive.  
I am starting DBT at a local hospital in a few weeks and will have to sign a contract not to kill myself for a year.  No relationship (and a self defeating contract....)
So I asked, "So, Dr. K, why is this supposed to mean anything to me.... and what are you gonna do to me if I break my promise??  Kill me again?"
But once I form a relationship with Dr. K I am sure that his expectation that I be in group and therapy will be a motivator to keep me alive.  
To sum up:  it is the relationship behind a promise and the sense of purpose it brings that saves a life.


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## Retired (Oct 8, 2006)

Superiority,

Suicide intervention is a formidable task, and it is obvious you care about someone important to you.

The goal of suicide intervention is to keep your friend safe until your friend can come in contact with competent professional help.

You can ask your friend for a promise to stay safe for a specified period of time, but the promise has to be backed up with an agreement to contact either a crisis line, or to be seen by a doctor or a mental health emergency service.

Do you know if your friend has attemped suicide before or if s/he uses drugs or alcohol?


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## Superiority Tails (Oct 8, 2006)

He told me at he was going to drink cleaner until he remembered my promise. Does that count as an attemped suicide?


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## David Baxter PhD (Oct 8, 2006)

What do *you* think about that, Superiority Tails? And what do you conclude from that about the promise this friend made?


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## Superiority Tails (Oct 8, 2006)

I think he's keeping it. He didn't kill himself even though he wanted to.


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## David Baxter PhD (Oct 8, 2006)

There you go. Either that or it wasn't a serious wish to die to begin with, but rather a statement of unhappiness or disatisfaction.


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## Superiority Tails (Oct 8, 2006)

Do you think it will pass?


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## David Baxter PhD (Oct 8, 2006)

Do I think what will pass?


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## Superiority Tails (Oct 8, 2006)

His unhappiness or disatisfaction.


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## David Baxter PhD (Oct 8, 2006)

I have no idea. You know this person; I don't. What do you think?


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## Superiority Tails (Oct 8, 2006)

I think he will.


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## Cheyenne (Oct 8, 2006)

Chances are that his feelings will pass and that he will feel better, eventually.
But, and I hate to bring up the negative, what if the feelings don?t go away? Would it be better to wait around and hope for the best, or talk with him, encourage him to seek help, and help him through it? Is it worth the risk? I don?t know your friend, but in my experience a promise as vague as that means very little, and it?s up to him to decide whether or not to keep it. If he chooses not to keep it, then what?

Even if he?s not entirely serious on it, what can encouraging or helping him seek help hurt? I think it could only help. If nothing else, it would show him that you care about him and are concerned for his well-being. 

This is just my opinion from experience, feel free to disagree, you know your friend while I don?t.


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## David Baxter PhD (Oct 8, 2006)

I agree, Cheyenne. Whether or not you think a suicide threat is serious, a cry for help, or attention-seeking, it is *always* wise to take it seriously. Even if the individual does not wish to end his/her life, s/he may do something drastic, even if unintentionally.


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## Superiority Tails (Oct 8, 2006)

Thanks everyone for the advice but I think it's best to play it when it comes by.


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## David Baxter PhD (Oct 8, 2006)

Superiority Tails said:


> Thanks everyone for the advice but I think it's best to play it when it comes by.





What do you mean?


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## Superiority Tails (Oct 8, 2006)

If the suicide thing comes up again I'll take care of it.


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## Retired (Oct 8, 2006)

The best way to prepare for the possibility of your friend ever talking about suicide is to get the phone number of your local crisis hotline and carry the number in your wallet.

If your friends has suicidal thoughts again,  phone the number and put your friend on the phone.

Have a look at *this Psychlinks thread *for suicide prevention resources


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## Misha (Oct 8, 2006)

Superiority Tails said:


> If the suicide thing comes up again I'll take care of it.



Very sorry, but that's like saying you'll buy insurance if the house burns down.


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## Halo (Oct 8, 2006)

Well Michelle I would tend to agree more with TSOW's advice where if I were ST I would arm myself with some information and crisis numbers in the event that it is needed in the future with this friend.  Maybe it will be and maybe not.  By your post your assuming that it will be and well to be honest we do not know ST's friend only he does.

Maybe another way of looking at it would be if there is another scare of the house burning down then I will buy insurance ??


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## Misha (Oct 8, 2006)

Yes I understand that we do not know the situation.  I am just sick of not being taken seriously when I am suicidal.... and sometimes I act on it and survive by a miracle and not intervention, and other times I just have to tough it out.  
When is enough crying for help enough?


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## Superiority Tails (Oct 9, 2006)

I hope he doesn't commit suicide. I just don't want to be hard on him.


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## Into The Light (Oct 9, 2006)

if you are seriously concerned about him, i would suggest you try to get him to commit to calling you first before he takes any action on taking his own life. then if he's in crisis, at least you'll know about it and you can take further steps to help him. have a plan ready for yourself up front what you would do if he called you and write it out, so that if/when the time comes, you know what to do.


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## David Baxter PhD (Oct 9, 2006)

qmnmd said:
			
		

> When is enough crying for help enough?


Perhaps you're asking the wrong people. But in any case, attempting suicide because someone isn't listening to you seems like just a bad plan to me.



			
				BBC said:
			
		

> i would suggest you try to get him to commit to calling you first before he takes any action on taking his own life


Or give him the information re: crisis lines now and try to get him to commit to calling them - and not waiting until he's once again actively suicidal.


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## Superiority Tails (Oct 9, 2006)

Thanks everyone.


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## healthbound (Oct 10, 2006)

Superiority Tails...Is the person you are concerned about related to you, a co-worker, a friend...??  And how _you _are doing through all of this???



> Quote:
> Originally Posted by BBC
> i would suggest you try to get him to commit to calling you first before he takes any action on taking his own life.



I made my sister promise to call me before attempting again.  She kept her promise and called me, but still did it anyway.  Immediately after we hung up, I drove to her, but was too late.

People absolutely can make a difference and impact another person's decision to take their own life (ESPECIALLY if the person is reaching out!!!), but I think it's equally important to hook the suicidal person up with professionals who are trained to deal with this.

What did you mean when you wrote,


> Originally Posted by Superiority Tails
> If the suicide thing comes up again I'll take care of it.


After reading how people responded, it looks like you meant that you wouldn't bring suicide up again unless He brings it up again.  Is that correct or did you mean something else?


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## Superiority Tails (Oct 10, 2006)

I'm just waiting for him to get better and I would reather him to bring it up then me. He's going through this and I don't want to bother him.


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## Into The Light (Oct 10, 2006)

ST, it's hard to bring up feeling suicidal. he might worry you don't want to hear about it, and keep it to himself. you could gently ask him if he's still having those kinds of thoughts. is he on medication? is he seeing a therapist? those are the things that would help make those thoughts less. if he is not on medication and getting counseling, then i highly doubt the thoughts are going away.

i think it is important you let him know that he can talk to you about feeling suicidal. if you don't talk about it anymore, he may feel it's a taboo subject with you.


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## Superiority Tails (Oct 10, 2006)

I'll talk to him about it. I hope everything goes well.


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## Retired (Oct 10, 2006)

ST,

as baseballcap mentions talking about suicide is not an easy subject, especially if you as a caring fiend want to bring it up and you are not accustomed to discussing suicide.

Here's one way such a conversation might get started,

"You know I care about you as a friend, and lately I've noticed that you have been doing  x, y and z.  You know sometimes people who do these things might be having thoughts of suicide.  Are you having thoughts of suicide?"

Don't be afraid of using the word suicide in your conversation, because you want to be clear about what you are talking about.  If you're going to have this conversation you need to be prepared with resources such as suicide help line contact information, and be ready to hear your friend say, "yes, I've been thinking of suicide".

Don't talk about hurting yourself or any other unclear language.

Another option would be to call a suicide help line yourself, and talk to a local counselor to find out what's the best way to help your friend in your community.


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## Superiority Tails (Oct 10, 2006)

Thanks. This will be very useful.


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## ^^Phoenix^^ (Oct 14, 2006)

Also ST 

As previously said, talking about it can be really scarey.  Their may be loooong gaps in conversation when he/she says nothing.  You may just need to sit and wait, as phrasing certain feelings of this nature is very hard.  The tendancy to feel stupid, annoying and a whole lot of other negetive feelings are probably haunting your friend, and the internal arguements may be so loud that they take time to clarify before being able to be spoken to you.  

I hope this makes sense.  Just remember, time and understanding is what they need. Hope it goes, (Or has gone) well.


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## Superiority Tails (Oct 15, 2006)

Thank you Phoenix.


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